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View Diary: Sci-Fi/Fantasy Club: The Moon is a Harsh Mistress (part 1) (216 comments)

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  •  It depends on the character (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    quarkstomper

    Hazel Stone, Sister Maggie, and Friday?  Yes.  Meade Stone, "Puddin'", and Podkayne?  Not really.  Heinlein's teenage girls are dreadful.

    •  Aren't all teenage girls somewhat dreadful?? (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      quarkstomper, Stude Dude

      I certainly was.

      "Shared pain is pain lessened; shared joy is joy increased."--Spider Robinson

      by Maggie Pax on Wed Aug 03, 2011 at 09:59:26 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  What I meant was that *Heinlein's* teenage girls (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        quarkstomper

        Were stereotypes, not actual characters.  Meade Stone was a boy crazy flirt (from what little we saw - unlike her brothers she never had chapter or more than a couple of pages devoted to her, plus her parents seemed determined to marry her off despite her being maybe 17, tops), Podkayne is a Valley Girl who has one inexplicable act of bravery (or foolishness, take your pick, and yes, I DO know that the book is supposedly a critique of bad parenting...which, curiously enough, seems directed largely at the mother, not the father or the uncle who gets Podkayne and her sociopathic brother into trouble in the first place), and "Puddin'" is a pathetic fat girl.  

        I'm not saying that there's no such thing as a boy crazy teenage flirt, or a Valley Girl, or a girl who eats too much and hates herself and her diet.  I am saying that there's a lot more to teenage girls than the above (or the narrator of "The Menace from Earth," who's supposedly boy crazy AND a mathematical genius with the discipline to design a starship AND is what, fourteen and has found the love of her life already?) would indicate.  

        Heinlein's teenage boys, from the Stone twins to Thor Rudbek to Johnny Rico to Matt the cadet and his friends, are much better characterized, much more diverse, and much more believable than any of Heinlein's teenage girls.  That is my problem with Meade, Podkayne, et al.  It's not them.  It's the way they're written.  

        •  Of course (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          quarkstomper

          Meade was just space filler--the book was designed and marketed to boy scouts, after all. But if the girl characters don't work for you, they don't work. They do work for many girl and women readers. To each her own.

          "Shared pain is pain lessened; shared joy is joy increased."--Spider Robinson

          by Maggie Pax on Wed Aug 03, 2011 at 11:52:33 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  I haven't met many women who liked them, actually (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            quarkstomper

            And I went to a women's college with enough SF/fantasy readers to found an SF club that's thriving thirty years later, so it's not as if I've lacked female SF readers to pal around with.  

            It's a pity, because Heinlein at his best was terrific...but I found this to be a big flaw, and I've found it more and more bothersome as I've gotten older.

        •  If more than that, what? (0+ / 0-)
          I am saying that there's a lot more to teenage girls than the above (or the narrator of "The Menace from Earth," who's supposedly boy crazy AND a mathematical genius with the discipline to design a starship AND is what, fourteen and has found the love of her life already?) would indicate.  

          So what more would you want from teenage girls?

          Does she have to be a politician too or something?

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