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  •  The progressive caucus is made up of Democrats. (1+ / 0-)
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    teknofyl

    Not a lot of Greens or anything else in that bunch.

    •  But a certain type of democrat right? (0+ / 0-)

      there would be no need if there wasn't a stated difference.

      Who shot ya? Seperate the weak from the ob-solete Hard to creep them Brooklyn streets It's on ____, f**k all that bickering beef I can hear sweat trickling down your cheek

      by mim5677 on Tue Aug 02, 2011 at 03:12:47 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  But what does that mean? (0+ / 0-)

        I'm not sure what you're up to with this.  Yes, there are different groups within the coalition.  There are blue dogs and progressives and a host of other self-identified groups.  But you don't seem to be advocating for that, you seem to be saying the progressives should leave the party and start their own party.  Am I missing something?  I find this whole line of argument very strange.

        •  I don't believe (0+ / 0-)

          blue dogs, or many of the other caucuses(sp?) could sustain themselves and I guess that is the big difference.

          Blue dog's with 26 members(moderate to conservative democrats)

          Progressive caucus as it stands now is at 80 much of which are made up of already powerful caucuses such as the hispanic and black caucus, right.

          With numbers that high in the house and policy still tilting towards the right no matter who is the president, does it not make you really wonder why it tilts so much that way?

          The tea party caucus has 60 members mind you and it has greatly affected the debate.

          To me the reason policy still goes right comes down to simple issues, one could be that the progressive caucus is pulling your leg.  I think the more plausible reason is that the democratic party is controlled by moderate and conservative democrats.  It's close to impossible to win with a progressive in the outskirts of MN and many other states, so on some level you have to succeed the middle of the country to moderates.  

          Back to my point.  The idea is not to have progressives leave but to free themselves from the oppressive nature of a democratic party that does it's best to ignore pushing for progressive issues(would you not agree)

          With 80 members in the house that is a movement that could be sustained, it's a movement that could create a more clear distinction between the left and right wings of the country and it would indeed allow for policy to begin shifting back towards the left.

          Take healthcare for example.  Because the progressive wing of the party is tied to democrats the debate begins from the democratic side where the most votes are, right?  The most votes are going to go with compromise as democrats see it.  On the GOP side where they have no problem tacking to the right and have far fewer moderates than the democratic party, they start all the way to the right.  Because of large majorities it worked out in our favor but what if we had the current numbers?  

          We'd be starting on the right cause they have the house and 60 senate votes would only come with GOP policy leading the way.  

          Progressives to me, from a strictly scorekeeping strategery point of view, squander millions of dollars they could use to keep in house and build a party independent of the DNC that could actually begin to bend U.S. policy in a way that would in most cases be acceptable to democrats.  We don't do it now because we don't have to.  We get the votes and the money and the hours anyway, right?  

          Well what do progressives get for it?  A blog and powerful words from Bernie Sanders?  If I were a progressive I would be sick to my stomach, because I can't get close to what I want, the debate doesn't even begin in a place I would consider and for the past 30 years the country has been adopting a very conservative military and economic policy.  

          The progressive caucus is probably one of the most powerful and well funded caucuses in congress, from some of the largest states where people give a lot of cash.  With citizen united as the law of the land, I don't see them not taking advantage of it.  

          If you can find a more effective way to begin shifting policy back to the left, you let me know.  I don't see it happening anytime soon on a federal level at least.  

          The demographics of the country are changing fast and if the democratic party continues to add more moderates and the GOP manages to shake some of the racism or perception of racism, you can kiss progressive policy goodbye.

          It's not a ploy to remove progressives from the democratic party, it's a ploy to shift policy to the left by allowing what I believe could be a clear alternative to GOP policy to stand independently as a left wing party, rather than what we have now, which is a right wing party and a party that is flexible and plays the middle.  

          I'm a middle person and will stay there no matter what but even I'm not blind to the fact that the left wing of what is supposed to be the left wing party, doesn't have the influence it should.  

          That's why we get the vitriol and the Obama's a ___ BS all the time, it's because they have no where to go, find somewhere to go and see what happens...

          You have to remember what my most important political principle is....I do not and will not vote for republicans period, and there are plenty of middle roaders like me who feel the same way.

          Could a progressive party raise 50 million dollars?
          Could a progressive party raise 100 million dollars?

          If the answer is yes to either one, I think you have more than a caucus on your hands.

          Who shot ya? Seperate the weak from the ob-solete Hard to creep them Brooklyn streets It's on ____, f**k all that bickering beef I can hear sweat trickling down your cheek

          by mim5677 on Tue Aug 02, 2011 at 08:00:38 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

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