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View Diary: Wisconsin recalls: Democrats hold double-digit leads in final two races (188 comments)

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  •  I'm not in Wisconsin, so I don't know (1+ / 0-)
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    Giles Goat Boy

    What reasons are given for recalling these Democrats? I understand why Republicans would be; they supported the Governor's "budget repair" massacre, which got news coverage outside the State. Why are some people at least upset with these 2 Democrats?

    Don't let millionaires steal Social Security.
    I said, "Don't let millionaires steal Social Security!"

    by Leo in NJ on Mon Aug 15, 2011 at 08:25:37 AM PDT

    •  not that complicated (1+ / 0-)
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      Leo in NJ

      1) people will sign anything
      2) GOPers wanted to have some insurance against the recalls, so they pushed for 6 recalls of their own. only 2 met the threshold however
      3) some people may be angry about the recalls.... so pushed for more

    •  The stated reason (10+ / 0-)

      Is generally that they "fled" the state earlier this year in an attempt to thwart the budget repair bill. The real reason, of course, is that the GOP wanted to spread the playing field to take some heat off their guys.

      Political Director, Daily Kos

      by David Nir on Mon Aug 15, 2011 at 08:37:35 AM PDT

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      •  No, they were not thwarting the bill (1+ / 0-)
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        exactly, and that misstates their purpose, making it too partisan to appeal to a lot of people who could be won.

        They were thwarting Walker's rush to approval of the bill in only a few days, without the process which is sacrosanct in Wisconsin, especially on bills of major impact:  public hearings, plural, and statewide, and with sufficient notice.  

        Walker's rush meant only one hearing, a couple of days later, in Madison, and intended to be for only two hours.   But that's why people rushed to the Capitol and signed up in such numbers that the hearing had to be continued and the sleep-in occurred as they waited in the halls to testify.  And then more rushed to Madison as word got out and about the state, especially when Vos and Darling (as JFC cochairs) had extended the hearing but then cut it off in the middle of the night, with hundreds still waiting to testify.  

        And then the Democrats held their rump aka unofficial hearings for the rest of those waiting to testify, and that continued the word getting out and about the state, and pressure built on Dems to do something to give more of us time to get to Madison -- and all that they had left to stop Walker's rush to the vote was to leave the state to provide more time for more of the public to testify, to talk about the impact, etc., all time-honored in Wisconsin.

        That is why they returned to not thwart the bill but to vote on it, when the public had had time to be heard.  The focus just on thwarting the bill suggests that they gave up on doing so, when they did not, because that was not the point -- they never could stop the bill without the majority in the state Senate, so that focus makes them look like "sore losers."

        They could effect the process of sufficient public notice and public testimony on the impact of the bill, which makes them look like winners for what is important in Wisconsin, and for voters on all sides of issues.  Say to voters, do you want the next Democratic governor and legislature to not hold real public hearings on bills?  Had the Dems not fled, that would have been the precedent that the LRB, AG, etc. could have cited in future. . . .

        And flouting of sacrosanct processes here is what did and continues to bring into the fold many people who are not public employees, who are not union members, etc., etc. -- flouting of process in elections, flouting of balance of powers in the tripartite government, etc.  

        That message about the core of good politics, long respected by both parties in the stae,  is what reaches many more voters, in addition to coming impact of Walker's budget-repair bill and biennial budget bill (two separate bills, two different biennia, although the budget-repair bill's non-budgetary items will continue to have impact in this biennium) on other aspects of life like education, health, etc.

        To focus only on the past, on Walker's action that is over and done, does not motivate voters by helping them to see that process matters, and that he will continue to flout process when it comes to issues closer to them.

        "Let all the dreamers wake the nation." -- Carly Simon

        by Cream City on Mon Aug 15, 2011 at 09:42:26 AM PDT

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        •  That is, he will continue to flout process (0+ / 0-)

          in future on issues closer to them UNLESS he is stopped by essentially a tied state Senate.  And that is what we will have if the two Dems hold their seats tomorrow (and just as effectively as if we had won three Repub seats last week -- that still would not have been enough to repeal Walker's agenda already put in place so far, which will take a much stronger majority in the legislature and/or a Dem governor to not veto such repeals).

          "Let all the dreamers wake the nation." -- Carly Simon

          by Cream City on Mon Aug 15, 2011 at 09:44:42 AM PDT

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        •  I wasn't offering my gloss (1+ / 0-)
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          I was just describing what I believe the GOP's claims are.

          Political Director, Daily Kos

          by David Nir on Mon Aug 15, 2011 at 11:13:21 AM PDT

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    •  When the Wisconsin 14 fled to Illinois (8+ / 0-)

      That started the whole recall process. GOP proposed recalls first because they were outraged that the 14 left.

      But to a big chunk of the state, the WI 14 are heroes, because they stood up for unions and the middle class. That's where I'm at ;-)

    •  "They left the state." (6+ / 0-)

      That is the entire campaign of the Tea party candidates running against them. They are attempting to portray the Wisconsin 14 as cowards who didn't do their job, but the truth is they wish they had someone on their side who would stand up for them the way the 14 did for us.

      The perception of the 14 among liberals and independents here is that they did something politically risky and ought to be admired for the courage of their convictions.

      The Republicans had opportunities to run mainstream local politicians against the Democrats, but they went with the fringe Tea Party candidates instead. Bad move, especially since they gave us an extra 4weeks to expose them as the extremist radicals they are by running a primary.

      It's not that easy being green.

      by Giles Goat Boy on Mon Aug 15, 2011 at 08:49:23 AM PDT

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    •  The term that is used against them (2+ / 0-)
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      morninmist, itskevin

      by the local right-wing blogs is "flee baggers" for having left the state to force the process issue that Walker was flouting, the process of sufficient -- in number and across the state geographically -- public hearings on bills of major impact.

      "Let all the dreamers wake the nation." -- Carly Simon

      by Cream City on Mon Aug 15, 2011 at 09:17:16 AM PDT

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      •  that phase has trickled down.... (0+ / 0-)

        from the GB Gazette


        6:03 PM on August 14, 2011

        Tuesday will be the time to get rid of both of these fleebaggers !!!

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