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View Diary: Criminal InJustice Kos: UK Riots in Context, Part I (129 comments)

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  •  the history of Blacks in Britain goes way back (6+ / 0-)

    to way before the 1940s.

    the Wikipedia article is actually pretty good:

    by the middle of the 18th century Blacks comprised somewhere between one and three percent of the London populace.  Evidence of the number of Black residents in London has been found through registered burials.
    •  yes -- although it really is (5+ / 0-)

      the immigration ways that make this a much larger issue

    •  I believe the black population of that era was (5+ / 0-)

      from the earlier slave trade (couldn't bring slaves into england after 1807? Is that correct?  Many also immigrated from the Caribbean plantations which were worked by enslaved people between 1600-1800.  I think.Haven't read the history in awhile.

      •  Slavery was abolished in England in the 1600s (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        soothsayer99, RadioGirl, Larsstephens

        sometime.  England proper, that is - it lasted in the Empire much longer.  So I think the blacks of that era were just people who showed up as sailors, immigrants, and so on.

        •  no, it was not ... (4+ / 0-)

          the slave trade was abolished in 1807 and the slavery abolition act was passed in 1833:

          After the passing of Abolition of the Slave Trade Act in 1807, British captains who were caught continuing the trade were fined £100 for every slave found on board. However, this law did not stop the British slave trade. If slave-ships were in danger of being captured by the British navy, captains often reduced the fines they had to pay by ordering the slaves to be thrown into the sea.

          Some people involved in the anti-slave trade campaign argued that the only way to end the suffering of the slaves was to make slavery illegal. A new Anti-Slavery Society was formed in 1823. Members included Thomas Clarkson, Henry Brougham, William Wilberforce, Thomas Fowell Buxton, Elizabeth Heyrick, Mary Lloyd, Jane Smeal, Elizabeth Pease and Anne Knight).

          Parliament passed the Slavery Abolition Act in 1833. This act gave all slaves in the British Empire their freedom. The British government paid compensation to the slave owners. The amount that the plantation owners received depended on the number of slaves that they had. For example, the Bishop of Exeter's 665 slaves resulted in him receiving £12,700 (http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/...).

          "Hegel noticed somewhere that all great world history facts and people so to speak twice occur. He forgot to add: the one time as tragedy, the other time as farce" Karl Marx, The Eighteenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte .

          by NY brit expat on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:35:30 PM PDT

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        •  fizziks - slavery ended in England in 1772- Slave (4+ / 0-)

          Trade outlawed in 1807 applying to all the colonies. to be fair there was a ruling at the end of the 1500s saying slavery was illegal in england.  Then in the early 1700s, because of the slavery in the colonies some wealthy people started to bring back slaves (not used in large scale for industry - ExPat right about that.) At end of 1700s outlawed again.

    •  yes, but the numbers are very small (5+ / 0-)

      the creation of a true statistically significant community only begins in the post-war period and it is that community that has fought against racism in the country. numbers previous were far lower and probably not seen by the upper classes as a threat.

      "Hegel noticed somewhere that all great world history facts and people so to speak twice occur. He forgot to add: the one time as tragedy, the other time as farce" Karl Marx, The Eighteenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte .

      by NY brit expat on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 05:44:47 PM PDT

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      •  with Britain I think it has always been more of (5+ / 0-)

        a "threat" in the colonial situation.  though they did have an anti-slavery movement.

        •  they had a very strong anti-slavery (4+ / 0-)

          movement which managed first to abolish the slave trade in 1807 and abolished slavery in 1833 freeing all slaves in the british empire. Please see my comment above; the argument was moral and they won despite the impact on the economy.

          "Hegel noticed somewhere that all great world history facts and people so to speak twice occur. He forgot to add: the one time as tragedy, the other time as farce" Karl Marx, The Eighteenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte .

          by NY brit expat on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:38:20 PM PDT

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          •  Part of the reason was that they didn't allow (4+ / 0-)

            slavery in england for a long time (enlightenment ethic).  they just kept it abroad.  Kind of like we don't torture, we
            send it abroad.  Actually, it probably had more to do with having enough arable land that wasn't already taken, so they kept it in the colonies.  

            An interesting sidenote is that some of the American Plantation owner revolutionaries fighting for "freedom" used the fact that Britain had ended slavery in the motherland and was going to end their participation in the slave trade as a reason to justify their separation from Britain.
            Nobody's history is quite as the pure as they like to make it.

            •  what I have always found interesting (5+ / 0-)

              is that while the enlightenment was used to justify American separation from the British empire, they only partially used the arguments of Locke who had advocated both universal suffrage and abolition of slavery based on the idea of property in one's own body and that no person could be the property of another. The ideas of the enlightenment that were useful were taken on board and those that were threatening to their own property and economic position and power were jettisoned. This is the case both with the UK and France as well; the enlightenment was not that period of pretty fantasy proposed by modern reinterpretation; it was a period of revolutionary change and its ideology was used for the creation of bourgeois democratic society which we know damn well is based upon the oppression and exploitation of the majority while pretending to give them a say in their governance. I do not know why I find the recreation of history and ideology interesting, but it is a driving research motivation for me.

              "Hegel noticed somewhere that all great world history facts and people so to speak twice occur. He forgot to add: the one time as tragedy, the other time as farce" Karl Marx, The Eighteenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte .

              by NY brit expat on Wed Aug 17, 2011 at 06:59:50 PM PDT

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