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View Diary: Me, My , Mine (16 comments)

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  •  when i first got the news that morning.... (2+ / 0-)
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    A Voice, Barth

    .... one of my first reactions was "we're at war."

    That was a military-grade attack that would have done credit to a small country's army.  It attacked a civilian center of commerce and the center of our nation's defense, and sought to attack the center of our government with the last plane.

    The potential for further attacks of that degree, was quite sufficient to go on a war footing, and then go to war to take out whoever was responsible if they were overseas actors rather than domestic.  

    •  The people on this site.... (0+ / 0-)

      ...and progressives everywhere, who do not understand this, are too far out of touch with the rest of the country to be taken seriously.  My first political thought that day was that the era of baby kissing and photo ops had to come to an end.  The presidency could no longer be a 24/7 political machine aimed at re-election, but needed to return to running a functional government.

      Of course, the man occupying the office at the time was not up to that task and, as Frank Rich has written this week, http://nymag.com/... the the ten years that followed have not been what might have been expected from a country united under attack.

      Important whining and Red Sox stuff at http://edsbarth.blogspot.com/

      by Barth on Sun Sep 04, 2011 at 05:37:43 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  where do I start... (0+ / 0-)

      My first reaction was sorrow, and horror at the death and sensational destruction. It was obviously not an act of war by some foreign power. It was a large and well planned crime, amazing in its scope, and could not have succeeded without some luck. I believe some gov't policies, and maybe even some negligence helped make it possible when all was said and done. I believe the response was wrongheaded and counterproductive, much like everything else the cheney admin did. It was obvious they had a well defined agenda ready and waiting and began implementing it immediately. War was their plan and from the first minutes the whole tragedy was framed to support the war agenda. We saw how legitimate their wars were... And we see as a country we're no better off for their response. As for the other respondent, you and the rest of the country I'm so out of touch with have been sold a bill of goods.

      •  "It was obviously not an act of war.... (0+ / 0-)

        ... by some foreign power".  If you mean it was not an act of war by a nation-state, I suppose you are right though I think a case could be made that it was an attack by Taliban-controlled Afghanistan since they harbored these people and made the attack possible.

        But legal reasoning based on concepts that are rapdily becoming antiquated is foolish.  It was an attack by the kind of semi-autonomous "states" that are now possible given the technology of the day.  A good case can be made that NAO ought to have intervened in Afghanistan before 9/11 given what the Taliban were doing to the civilian population there, much as NATO intervened in Libya under similar circumstances.

        Iraq was, of course, a fraud in the way you describe.

        Important whining and Red Sox stuff at http://edsbarth.blogspot.com/

        by Barth on Mon Sep 05, 2011 at 09:15:06 AM PDT

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        •  this is all opinion of course... (0+ / 0-)

          ...but if you watched what the cheney/bush crime syndicate said and what turned out to be the truth, over time patterns emerged. I believe AQ is a criminal organization, much like the "mafia" or the gop. I think whatever Taliban presence there was in Afg didn't require our occupying the country for 10 years or even 1, but could have been dealt with in weeks. I don't believe for an instant Afg or Iraq occupations had anything to do with national security and indeed actually harmed it. Anyone who profited is a criminal as are the ones who instigated/sold the wars to begin with. The cheney regime was all about selling the gov't and looting the country, while ruling as authoritarians, disregarding the law, and working to isolate themselves from any accountability to the people (or anyone else). They looted (and continue to loot) 100s of billions in these wars, sent 1000s of Americans to their deaths, and set a new standard for the concept of cannon fodder. And not only do they walk free, but people put them on tv and let them lie their asses off about it.

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