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View Diary: Open thread for night owls: A stock transfer tax makes good sense (178 comments)

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  •  It'll only be effective if it's not just a protest (3+ / 0-)

    It must be more: the foundation of a long-term, large-scale movement.  To accomplish something of the magnitude that is necessary requires a very broad coalition — one truly representative of the breadth of society and of sufficient size to frighten those in power, and those who have bought them.  

    Building that kind of coalition takes time.  And the patient stoking of popular anger. We learned from Wisconsin that we have to be willing to stay and harass the bastards for weeks, if not months.  We're still only a few weeks into this.  The specific demands should reflect the makeup of the supporters, and not all of them are known or on board yet.  All that will gel as the movement coalesces.  

    Shirley Chisholm was right. Our Republic is in deep trouble.

    by Big River Bandido on Sat Oct 08, 2011 at 12:09:01 AM PDT

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    •  I quite agree (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      isabelle hayes, stolen water

      What we need, literally, is a counterculture--an entire social framework that exists in opposition to our current social construction. The basic flaw in our existing society--"rich people run things and poor people don't"--permeates every area of society and molds all its relationships and structures.  These will ALL need to be remade, from the bottom up. Needless to say, the task of remaking all of human society from the ground up will be long and hard. And it will require a huge organization--or, more correctly, it will require a huge alliance of many different organizations, each focusing its efforts on one area of social structure, and each in turn nestled within the large umbrella group that unifies and coordinates them all. Further, since the current social structure is global in scope and reach, so too must be the counter-organization; it is no longer enough for us to organize and motivate people in the US to fight back--we need to mobilize and coordinate people EVERYWHERE, all over the globe.

      It will be a massive undertaking, it will require an enormous amount of work, and it will not happen in days, weeks, months, years or maybe even decades. But it must be done, and there are no shortcuts to doing it.  We have to be in for the long haul. The gains made by the counterculture in the 60's--the civil rights movement, the environmental movement, the labor movement, the consumer protection movement, the gay rights movement, the feminist movement--took two or three decades to reach that level of effectiveness. Ours will probably take longer.

      •  we had a window of opportunity in 'o9 (0+ / 0-)

        The protesters are conservatives in this sense, they call for the rule of law. The real radicals are the rapacious oligarchic class. ~ chris hedges

        by stolen water on Sat Oct 08, 2011 at 02:09:20 AM PDT

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        •  Political campaigns and activism are not the same (0+ / 0-)

          The former are top-down, and when associated with any kind of "movement", are usually nothing but Astroturf by another name.  

          Real activism comes from the real grassroots and bubbles up those those who hold power.  

          Shirley Chisholm was right. Our Republic is in deep trouble.

          by Big River Bandido on Mon Oct 10, 2011 at 08:31:27 AM PDT

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    •  And, they've put a call out for all things wintery (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      stolen water, isabelle hayes

      coats, blankets, sleeping bags, thermal underwear. Donations addresses here:

      Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from a religious conviction. -- Blaise Pascal

      by RJDixon74135 on Sat Oct 08, 2011 at 01:34:38 AM PDT

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    •  I cite Egypt as proof that in order to (0+ / 0-)

      stick it out for the long haul, regardless of any tricks the authorities employ, specific demands must be enumerated. If North Africa really is the model for this, people must understand that this won't go anywhere without demanding things with the same ferocity that the Tunisians and Egyptians were.

      They had a clear list hung in Tahrir, and whenever Mubarak or Suleiman announced they were gonna do this or that, the people couldn't be divided or maneuvered around because they had a specific list of hard demands, and they clung to those demands despite being lied to, beaten, tortured, charged at with camels, and finally shot at in cold blood. They knew specifically why they were there, and while every single person couldn't have agreed with every jot and tittle on that list, it was a unifying force. It was their backbone against one of the worst crony capitalist regimes that existed.

      This movement needs that backbone. It doesn't need any leadership whatsoever, any political backing, or any complex plans. The model for open source protesting can and should be adhered to vigorously, but there must be simple and specific demands to rally around and stick to. I so badly want this movement to succeed, and nothing would please me more than for them to eat Wall Street's lunch. If specific demands are going to coalesce as you suggest, that's very good news.

      "A man doesn't save a century, or a civilization, but a militant party wedded to a principle can." - Adlai E. Stevenson

      by Zutroy on Sat Oct 08, 2011 at 10:39:43 AM PDT

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      •  I just think things like this (0+ / 0-)

        need time to take on a life of their own.

        Sorry for my delay in responding.  I work most of the weekend so this is the first chance I've had to catch up here.

        Shirley Chisholm was right. Our Republic is in deep trouble.

        by Big River Bandido on Mon Oct 10, 2011 at 08:32:51 AM PDT

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