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View Diary: Unnecessary Side Tracks to Progressive Discussions (27 comments)

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  •  state the sins (0+ / 0-)

    you perceive from religious progressives. How have these people wronged you, making you feel alienated from the Progressive Movement?

    Otherwise, this sounds just like the same Third Way (DLC) claptrap I'm used to hearing about the virtues of Grand Compromises between sides that are not doing an equal amount of problems.

    Above Grecian mantles were chiseled these words... Know Thyself... Nothing in Excess... the pop philosophy of its day.

    by ravagerofworlds2 on Mon Nov 07, 2011 at 05:14:18 PM PST

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    •  ok... (0+ / 0-)

      1) Some religious liberals claim that atheists don't understand spirituality and don't have spiritual lives, often using metaphors like "blind and deaf."

      2) Some religious liberals claim that atheists are morally ungrounded, linking us to Joseph Stalin or using the TAG to deny that we can be moral.

      3) Some religious liberals claim that atheists are acting in bad faith in participating in inter/transfaith discussions.  They start with the assumption of "evangelical" rudeness, and then deny participation and/or organization preemptively on that basis.

      4) Some religious liberals prefer to engage in atheism by attacking new/gnu atheists, rather than working with atheists who are already in their coalitions and/or religious denominations.

      •  systematic response (0+ / 0-)

        1) I've never read such a thing, but believe it probably has occurred if this is your experience. It has been my experience, that in real life, my encounters with atheists (1 of whom is a good friend, and several others who are extremely rude and snide when they learned I wasn't one of them despite being in science) lead me to believe that most atheists share one commonality with most Christians- a general ignorance of what specific belief systems actually advocate. They make judgments based on a scarecrow argument of how wrongfully they perceive the "other side."

        2) Morals are not grounded in any specific belief system. Morals exist apart as universal moralities (theft, murder, rape, etc., are not moral). If you study the above post, you'll see I've already noted this the first time I wrote this post. If any have said so, I vehemently disagree with them. I even start the "after the fold" referencing the characters of Socrates, Plato and Aristotle and how Christianity has positively given them the best status it can for nonbelievers.

        3) You'll need to explain this one more fully.

        4) This seems more like an organizational complaint to me, and I cannot say anything about how other denominations conduct business with their current members. This is part of the earthly side of the Church. Each organization deals with members who denounce the organization's ideals in different ways (but usually, by asking them to leave and no longer bother current members). I've been "excommunicated" by an evangelical free church because of my mother's divorce to my father before I was 5. I don't hold grudges- but I do think their reasoning was barbaric. But because of their actions, I became a member of a time honored denomination, firmly in the mainstream of protestantism.

        Above Grecian mantles were chiseled these words... Know Thyself... Nothing in Excess... the pop philosophy of its day.

        by ravagerofworlds2 on Mon Nov 07, 2011 at 06:14:52 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

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