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View Diary: Breaking: Has Keystone XL hit a roadblock? (66 comments)

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  •  For those who want the base fired up (14+ / 0-)

    Isn't this maybe one of the only/last executive decisions the President can do to wake up the base?

    It seems like a win win to me.

    First whose votes will he lose if he stops this project?

    Especially when he frames it as:
    "The risk far outweigh the rewards.  The oil is produced and exported by Canadian firms.  A privately maintained pipeline could burst on our land, and be our cost to clean it up.
    And in the end, the crude will be pumped to refineries owned by international corporations."

    or if he is really bold:
    "The production of Oil Sands for Petroleum products is extremely dirty and affects AMERICAN air.  We reject this pipeline in protest to this petroleum production project."

    Yea, I see him losing lots of those precious independent douchnozzles if he went this way :D

    •  whose votes will he lose? (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      SpamNunn

      If Obama vetoes the XL, it will certainly erode his support among;

      1.4 million teamsters
      300,000 pipefitters
      400,000 operating engineers
      500,000 laborers

      thousands of workers at 39 refineries around the Gulf

      hundreds of steelworkers in Arkansas where the pipe is supposed to be made

      hundreds of craft workers who want to build the pumping stations and tank farm

      I fear this is a win-lose situation.

      •  He'll gain more than that. (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        m00finsan, dewley notid

        And he'll gain an indefinable number of votes due to the increased activism and the get-out-the-vote effort of the many thousands of fired up supporters.

        Otherwise, many will sit home, and certainly most will not work for his election campaign.

      •  Exactly. Unions > Tree Huggers. (0+ / 0-)

        If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do? - Psalms 11:3

        by SpamNunn on Mon Nov 07, 2011 at 05:00:48 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  I would like to see your evidence for (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        pot, George Pirpiris

        the numbers in your post.

        •  The numbers (0+ / 0-)

          are the memberships of four of the construction craft unions supporting the pipeline, available on line from many sources; wikipedia, the Labor Dept. etc.

          I didn't estimate the refinery and steel workers, not having good numbers for the Gulf refineries and Arkansas steel mills employment. There are about 30,000 refinery workers, figuring 900 workers per refinery.  A steel mill employs about 1000 hands.

          The problem is that if Obama kills XL, he may obtain the fevered support of thousands of treehuggers who will then hopefully support him extra hard, but could alienate thousands of building trades union members who may decide not to support him.

          •  The 'political' challenge is (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Seamus D, George Pirpiris

            putting together a better policy program that will foster job creation for these very unions in numbers an order of magnitude higher than this.  

            There is something developing (no, I won't go into it) that would achieve this with zero direct dollars from the Federal treasury. And, if the things fall correctly, it will be a Republican initiative that will create 100,000s of jobs while setting the stage for a dramatic cut in carbon emissions.

            In any event, what about the unions that have stated opposition to the pipeline such as AmAlgamated Transit Union (ATU) and the Transport Workers Union (TWU). ATU is 190,000 members and the TWU is about 200,000.

            And, well, the Obama political team had better work to help the union leadership understand the real numbers rather than the gamed figures that are being spun right now.

            Blogging regularly at Get Energy Smart NOW! for a sustainable energy future.

            by A Siegel on Mon Nov 07, 2011 at 06:51:42 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  you are right (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              A Siegel

              and Obama faces a serious political challenge if he fails to produce a better policy program that fosters job creation.

              His stimulus spending went part way, his loan guarantee support for the Vogtle nuke, solar plants, and other projects helped, but unemployment still festers.

              While the ATU and TWU do oppose the XL, they have much smaller membership,whose jobs aren't at stake compared with the affected building trades unions.

              So I doubt Obama will gain much with those ATU and TWU by killing XL, but he will probably hurt himself measurably with the building trades.

      •  Evidence for your vast numbers? (0+ / 0-)

        #occupywallstreet "Either you taste, feel and smell the intoxication of freedom and revolt or sink into the miasma of despair and apathy. Either you are a rebel or a slave." -- Chris Hedges

        by pot on Mon Nov 07, 2011 at 06:51:49 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

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