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View Diary: Indians 201: American Indians and European Diseases (63 comments)

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  •  Actually, so did the Aztecs during the... (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    navajo, Portlaw, Ojibwa, Kitsap River

    ...first round. Cortes and his band of Spaniards and Indians allies barely survived. But then they returned.

    The surest way to predict the future is to invent it. — Stephen Post. [Me at Twitter.]

    by Meteor Blades on Thu Nov 17, 2011 at 08:28:23 PM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  It's a very complicated story (0+ / 0-)

      and any gamer is driven to the conclusion that Cortez rolled a couple of natural 20s at crucial moments. :-) It could so easily have gone the other way...and what might have happened then?

      The Cortez expedition was staged from Cuba and financed from Spain. Would there have been willingness to mount another one after the failure of the first? (The governor of Cuba tried, but failed, to stop Cortez from setting out in the first place - he was "for it before he was against it", in modern parlance.)

      If the Mesoamericans had had even a decade or two to themselves, would they have been able to regroup and hold off any other prospective invaders?

      Food for thought for people constructing alternate histories....

      \

      If it's
      Not your body
      Then it's
      Not your choice
      AND it's
      None of your damn business!

      by TheOtherMaven on Fri Nov 18, 2011 at 11:05:33 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  alternative to what? (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Ojibwa

        White European history?

        History is written by the "winners" after all, right?

        In our sleep, pain which cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart until, in our own despair, comes wisdom through the awful grace of God ~RFK

        by vcmvo2 on Sat Nov 19, 2011 at 02:17:57 PM PST

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        •  Guess you never considered writing fiction at all (0+ / 0-)

          because the point went whizzing right over your head.

          "Alternate history" is a popular science-fiction genre, and every once in a while somebody plays around with what-ifs involving the Native Americans. What if they had been solidly contacted much earlier, by the Carthaginians or some other pre-Roman seafaring peoples? What if it was the Romans who made the contact? What if the Norse had been able to sustain their colonies? (See a couple of Poul Anderson stories, among other works.) What if Cortez' conquest had failed? (Andre Norton's Quest Crosstime does an interesting job of extrapolating from this hypothesis.)

          If it's
          Not your body
          Then it's
          Not your choice
          AND it's
          None of your damn business!

          by TheOtherMaven on Sat Nov 19, 2011 at 11:38:37 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Oh I got your point (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Ojibwa, Kitsap River

            history has always been fiction written by the "victors." You went way out of your way to make your point. I don't really see why you need to promote your point as if it's the only pov out there.

            In our sleep, pain which cannot forget falls drop by drop upon the heart until, in our own despair, comes wisdom through the awful grace of God ~RFK

            by vcmvo2 on Sun Nov 20, 2011 at 01:11:06 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

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