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View Diary: The Nuclear Option is Coming. Are you ready? (140 comments)

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  •  Reid knows how to count votes (none)
    If he sees this coming I propose he use his own "nuclear option" and pull unanimous consent immediately and shut down the Senate.

    http://dumpjoe.com/

    by ctkeith on Sat Apr 02, 2005 at 10:49:48 AM PST

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    •  well, that's the response (none)
      But it's only going to last so long, because the Republicans will keep moving bills to the floor that "need" votes "immediately" and we'll "look bad" if we don't comply.

      I do think they have the 51 votes.  Even if they lose Chafee, Collins and Snowe, that still leaves 1-2 votes of a margin.  And they may well grab a Nelson or two.

      •  If the repubs pull the Nuclear option (none)
        Screw any legislation at all.It's WAR.

        http://dumpjoe.com/

        by ctkeith on Sat Apr 02, 2005 at 11:03:02 AM PST

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        •  I agree it's war... (none)
          ...but will the Democrats in the Senate fight or roll over?
          •  Either way... (none)
            Democrats are screwed.  If the Democrats shut down the Senate, the Republican echo chamber will scream "Obstructionist!"  And it will work:  60% of the public will believe it's all the nasty Democrats fault for not working with the Republicans.  And then, of course, they'll be massive in-fighting among progressives, as they blame the Democrats for allowing this to happen in the first place.

            I am not optimistic.  

        •  History Books (none)
          The last time one party declared war and shut down the Congress, they lost miserably.
          •  Except this time... (none)
            It's the Democrats who will be shutting down Congress.  At least that's how 60% of the public will perceive it.
            •  wrong (none)
              Clinton was popular Bush is not.You can't ask for backbone from the dems and then say  don't use it.Believe it or not most americans think much more highly of the Courts than you are giving them credit for.The Shiavo Fiasco assured the Nuclear option will be a loser for the Republicans.IF the Democratic party refuses to fight this fight with every weapon at their disposal its done.

              http://dumpjoe.com/

              by ctkeith on Sat Apr 02, 2005 at 11:54:29 AM PST

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              •  how right you are (none)
                We're falling in the Republicans' trap by talking about process. With Schiavo, we have a perfect example that the Repubs don't really care about "activist judges"; they just want judges who will rule they want to.
              •  let's see: (none)
                Clinton's job approval when Gingrich shutdown began: 52% approve, 41% disapprove

                Bush's, right now: 49% approve, 46% disapprove.

                No real difference.

              •  Hope. (none)
                I hope you're right.  FWIW, Clinton was not terribly popular in late 95 when the Gov't shut down occurred.  People felt like he was lame, and Gingrich was driving things. We'd gotten smacked in the 94 elections, we lost the big health care debate,  and Clinton was on the defensive.

                The Schiavo factor is interesting--I hadn't thought of it.  Maybe their overplaying their cards on that has hurt their chances to win this fight.  Thanks for making that point.

                Whatever happens, the Democratic party is not "done" based on what happens in the Senate this year. There are literally thousands of elected Dems across the 50 states--in town halls and state assemblies and the US Congress.  As we work to build an agenda and organize around our issues, we can change the landscape. One might even argue that letting some of the big name brand Dems at the top fail could clear space for newer, more aggressive leadership.  There is no reason to stop fighting for our values, and we mustn't let the decisions made by Lieberman or Nelson or even Reid stop us.

                "Calmer than you are, dude."

                by Sheffield on Sun Apr 03, 2005 at 09:46:30 AM PDT

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