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View Diary: Empathy for Michelle Duggar (183 comments)

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  •  A D&C at this point... (5+ / 0-)

    is an ABORTION.

    Abortion Clinics OnLine, the world's first and largest source for online abortion clinic information. Join my DK Abortion Group.

    by annrose on Fri Dec 09, 2011 at 10:11:24 AM PST

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    •  really? (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      jennifree2bme, Thinking Fella

      Do you have a definition for the word abortion? (I'm not trolling, seriously, would like to know).  I know many women who have had to have a D&C because their body would not miscarry but there was not hearbeat.  Is an abortion just considered the removal of the fetus/tissue (dead or alive)?  And then what does that make RU486? no removal there.  This is what I used for my abortion, and so I'm not clear if the abortion occured with the first medicine (which ended the pregnancy) or the second (which expelled the pregnancy).  I've also had a D&C for a retained placenta (after my son's full term stillbirth) which doesn't qualify, although we are talking about removing tissue (so is that an abortion?)

      So really, I'm interested in the actual definitions here, and then the popular use of the term.  

      -7.3,-7.5 If I can't dance, I don't want to be part of your revolution.

      by Nebraska Outsider on Fri Dec 09, 2011 at 11:53:34 AM PST

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      •  Ok--graphic words ahead: (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Clytemnestra, annrose

        ANY pregnancy that does not result in a live birth is considered(medically speaking) an abortion. There are "spontaneous abortions"-wherein the woman's body 'self aborts'. Typically this occurs early in pregnancy, and it is thought that 25% of all pregnancies end this way. It occurs because a woman's body is not quite ready to be pregnant that month--for 1000's of reasons. In lay terms, this is what occurs when a woman is 2-3 weeks late, then gets her period. The other kind of abortion is called a "therapuetic abortion". This occurs when the pregnancy is terminated by any means other than by a live birth or spontaneous abortion. A "D&C" is the medical procedure named a 'Dilatation & Cutiledge'...where the cervix is dialated, and cutiledge(I don't think I'm spelling that correctly) means "scrapping" in medical speak. In this case, the fertilized egg is scrapped from the uterine wall. Hence...a D&C is the term for the medical procedure that is used for an abortion.

        D&C is also another word for "nice girls" to use instead of saying they had an abortion-since abortion is a very loaded word. Many women have D&C's for reasons that have NOTHING to do with birth control failure, lack of birth control usage, or anything like that. They need them to live, as pregnancy can & does kill women. Also...a D&C is also done for things that have nothing to do with pregnancy. Removal of a growth(including embryo's & NOT including embryo's) are done in a D&C.
        Which is why keeping this medical procedure safe, legal, and AVAILABLE to all women is crucial. Not to mention...if a woman does not control her own reproductive system, she is not free.
        So there you go. Any women want me to explain the menstrual cycle to them? Just kidding. But you know-people have such strong opinions on abortion yet they have no clue what they are talking about. Sad, really.

        "The better I know people, the more I like my dog."

        by Thinking Fella on Fri Dec 09, 2011 at 03:29:15 PM PST

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        •  oh-RU486 (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Clytemnestra

          It prevents a fertilized egg from being attached to the uterine wall. The fertilized egg is passed just as a non-fertilized egg would be. Calling that an abortion would be a stretch in my opinion. But that doesn't stop Forced Birther's from calling it that. RU-486 does prevent a live birth from occurring-hence their rationale for calling it such. Dishonest at best...

          "The better I know people, the more I like my dog."

          by Thinking Fella on Fri Dec 09, 2011 at 03:35:02 PM PST

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          •  not quite right (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Thinking Fella
            Mifepristone is sold outside the U.S. by Exelgyn Laboratories as Mifegyne, made in France, and is approved for:

              1. Medical termination of intrauterine pregnancies of up to 49 days gestation (up to 63 days gestation in Britain and Sweden)
               2. Softening and dilatation of the cervix prior to mechanical cervical dilatation for pregnancy termination
               3. Use in combination with gemeprost for termination of pregnancies between 13 and 24 weeks gestation
               4. Labor induction in fetal death in utero.[15]
            http://en.wikipedia.org/...

            the fertilized egg has implanted

            Bumper sticker seen on I-95; "Stop Socialism" my response: "Don't like socialism? GET OFF the Interstate highway!"

            by Clytemnestra on Fri Dec 09, 2011 at 04:03:07 PM PST

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        •  D&C are also used to remove polyps inside the (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Thinking Fella

          uterus (had this done - talked about it in this diary)

          Bumper sticker seen on I-95; "Stop Socialism" my response: "Don't like socialism? GET OFF the Interstate highway!"

          by Clytemnestra on Fri Dec 09, 2011 at 03:58:40 PM PST

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        •  what about stillbirths? (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Clytemnestra

          As far as I know, they're called fetal demise or fetal death.  

          -7.3,-7.5 If I can't dance, I don't want to be part of your revolution.

          by Nebraska Outsider on Sat Dec 10, 2011 at 03:34:59 AM PST

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        •  if you read my post (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Clytemnestra

          I obviously know pregnancy kills as a retained uterus almost killed me and a D&C saved me.  Did you read my post?

          -7.3,-7.5 If I can't dance, I don't want to be part of your revolution.

          by Nebraska Outsider on Sat Dec 10, 2011 at 03:35:55 AM PST

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          •  Ah- (0+ / 0-)

            I did read. Didn't mean to cause any ill feelings.

            Ok, medically speaking...All pregnancies end in a live birth or an aborted pregnancy. If the fetus is not a live birth, then some form of abortion takes place. Usually-although I have no idea of numbers here- a fetus will be spontaneously aborted and passed or delivered. Again, no numbers here, but if the baby doesn't deliver, it must be removed-as you sadly know. A woman in a coma, in otherwise good health, will naturally & spontaeously go into labor and deliver the baby. If it is not delivered by the womans body, as I suspect happened to you, a 'therapuetic abortion' will be performed, and the procedure used will be a D&C. I'm not an Ob/Gyn, so there could be another procedure used depending on many other factors. Am I being more clear?
            I would like to be very clear about 2 things for sure. First, I am very sorry that happened to you. Having your health imperiled is bad enough, having the loss of an expected child included compounds that 1000 fold. I'm sorry. And secondly...abortion is a very loaded word. And the use of euphonisms can compound the problem. Miscarriage, "D&C" used as a substitute, even 'personhood' mean different things to different people. I apologize if my discussion of these words either confused or hurt you in any way. That was not my intention.

            "The better I know people, the more I like my dog."

            by Thinking Fella on Sun Dec 11, 2011 at 06:17:23 PM PST

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