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View Diary: Arrests at White House Over NDAA Military Detention of Americans, Occupy Wall Street Joins Fight. (34 comments)

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  •  Oh come one (6+ / 0-)

    He posted a link to their website in their diary and encourages readers to go there "for more information"...that's not support? Give me a break.

    This is not a group of moderate or libertarian leaning republicans, this is a far right MILITIA MOVEMENT. Do you seriously not see any problem with this? Do we really want OWS associated with them? I had heard rumors that alliances were being formed but I had just assumed that was put out there by people trying to marginalize OWS. Now this diary makes the implicit connection. If you want to become a fringe movement and lose all public support, this is exactly how you do it.

    The world breaks everyone and afterward many are strong in the broken places ~Ernest Hemingway
    Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle ~ Anonymous

    by SwedishJewfish on Sat Dec 31, 2011 at 03:09:04 PM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  Let them speak for themselves (0+ / 0-)

      I read the Mother Jones you cite, it takes one guy as if he speaks for all  of Oathkeepers and puts a scary picture of him with a gun in the article.  But the person who speaks for O.K. is Stewart Rhodes, a Yale Law School graduate and winner of a prestigious writing prize.  

      Rhodes denies that Oath Keepers is a militia.  It is a "stand-down" organization, as he says in the interview below, which only vows to disobey orders to commit violence against their fellow citizens.  How is that violent?  The "reports" I have seen on O.K. go to a lot of links which have nothing to do with Oath Keepers, "guilt by hypertext link."  

      The main complaint of the SPLC against Oath Keepers seems to be that they are "paranoid" and believe the government will start using the military against American citizens.  Good thing with NDAA we know that could never happen, huh?

      So I say take them for what they say with complete consistency and watch Rhodes below.  If you are going to judge them at least hear and read their side of it.  When you've got nothing, guilt by association is always the cheapest route.

      The central mission statement, "Orders We Will Not Obey."
      http://oathkeepers.org/...

      1. We will NOT obey orders to disarm the American people.

      2. We will NOT obey orders to conduct warrantless searches of the American people

      3. We will NOT obey orders to detain American citizens as “unlawful enemy combatants” or to subject them to military tribunal.

      4. We will NOT obey orders to impose martial law or a “state of emergency” on a state.

      5. We will NOT obey orders to invade and subjugate any state that asserts its sovereignty.

      6. We will NOT obey any order to blockade American cities, thus turning them into giant concentration camps.

      7. We will NOT obey any order to force American citizens into any form of detention camps under any pretext.

      8. We will NOT obey orders to assist or support the use of any foreign troops on U.S. soil against the American people to “keep the peace” or to “maintain control."

      9. We will NOT obey any orders to confiscate the property of the American people, including food and other essential supplies.

      10.We will NOT obey any orders which infringe on the right of the people to free speech, to peaceably assemble, and to petition their government for a redress of grievances.

      Watch this, I'd say Chris Mathews is the one  who comes out looking like the nut.

      •  Sure, right, umhmm (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        SwedishJewfish, Geekesque
        Oath Keepers is not preaching violence or government overthrow, Rhodes said. On the contrary, it is asking police and the military to lay down their arms in response to unlawful orders.

        The group's Web site, www.oathkeepers.org, features videos and testimonials in which supporters compare President Barack Obama's America to Adolf Hitler's Germany. They also liken Obama to England's King George III during the American Revolution.

        One member, in a videotaped speech at an event in Washington, D.C., calls Obama "the domestic enemy the Constitution is talking about."

        Of course, the question has been raised that there suddenly emerged a need for such a group shortly after Obama's election. Rhodes claims this was not the case:

        Rhodes, a former firearms instructor, said he easily could have started Oath Keepers during the Bush administration, but his focus during those years was first on getting his law degree and then volunteering on the 2008 presidential campaign of Texas Congressman Ron Paul, a libertarian Republican in whose office Rhodes worked during the 1990s.

        And yes, there's "guilt by hypertext"
        The group's state director in Montana, who goes by the name Elias Alias, has said Montana and other states should consider seceding from the United States in protest of the federal government's conduct.
        Another prominent Oath Keeper is former Arizona sheriff Richard Mack, who has long been an outspoken government critic.

        The Southern Poverty Law Center calls Mack a "longtime militia hero" who helped weaken gun control laws.

        http://www.lvrj.com/...

        As noted in another comment - you are known by the company you keep. And so is he.

        from a bright young conservative: “I’m watching my first GOP debate…and WE SOUND LIKE CRAZY PEOPLE!!!!”

        by Catte Nappe on Sat Dec 31, 2011 at 04:24:38 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  I'm not basing my opinion on them (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Nada Lemming, mookins, Geekesque

        from one article in Mother Jones, I'm basing it on almost a years worth of research into the white separatist movement and it's ties to the Patriot movement, including the Oath Keepers and the Sovereign Citizens movement.

        Rhodes is a very smart man, and a very good spokesperson who puts a good spin on what his organization is all about. Very much like David Duke in that way. However all you need to do is look at the comments on their website from rank and file members to understand what they are all about.

        The world breaks everyone and afterward many are strong in the broken places ~Ernest Hemingway
        Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle ~ Anonymous

        by SwedishJewfish on Sat Dec 31, 2011 at 04:24:52 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  Wow- blockade cities, invade U.S. States, (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Geekesque, aigeanta

        foreign troops? These are paranoid delusions. Lots of weirdos around American politics these days.

        •  Wow - US troops arrest American citizens? (0+ / 0-)

          Martial law?  They must be crazy man!

          But thanks for watching the Mathews interview, what Mathews interestingly skips is the higher orders on the list, the ones about warrantless searches and

          3. We will NOT obey orders to detain American citizens as “unlawful enemy combatants” or to subject them to military tribunal.

          4. We will NOT obey orders to impose martial law or a “state of emergency” on a state.

          ...that last one being about Posse Comitatus and all.  

          But obviously you are a young 'un who doesn't remember Hurricane Katrina when Blackwater was patrolling the streets and the soldiers were shooting at civilians to keep them from crossing into wealthier areas, or concentration camps for Japanese Americans during WWII.  They even got a settlement for it, so you know it really happened.  But whoever the next group is (OWS, radicals, whatever they say) the Japanese-Americans had it better than you will.  Because your war by definition lasts forever.

          You just had the government pass the authority to lock you up and throw away the key, right in fromnt of your eyes.   And you are still calling people "paranoid delusional?"  People like you scare me.

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