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View Diary: Occupy Together - Occupy Within (34 comments)

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  •  More navel-gazing... (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    EarTo44, SquirrelWhisperer

    ...won't solve our nation's problems.

    I'll take one person who's taking real action, in the real world of reality, over ten people who are "occupying within" by taking "self inventory" and "deeply questioning" whether things are real.

    We need soul power in this fight, true—but the soul power we need is soul power like Dr. King's, soul power that isn't directed inward in self-indulgence, but rather outward to love of others and love of justice. We need the soul power that produces strength and perseverance, not the kind that produces eternally circular self-questioning and doubt.

    We know what justice is and what injustice is; the only "inventory" we need is to determine and analyze what actions are effective for bringing about that justice and growing the moral strength to take those actions.

    True spirituality, true religion, leads to action for justice; if one's "self-inventory" leads them to do nothing while they're questioning everything, it is completely and totally worthless.

    "When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist." --Dom Helder Camara, archbishop of Recife

    by JamesGG on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 06:07:24 AM PST

    •  Occupy blew it. In some ways. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      SquirrelWhisperer

      All of these people, including myself, united.  
      With no goal.  No united front on what to vote on.

      OWS demanded we stay out of "politics"  and not take one side or the other.

      And that is when they lost me.    I was thinking,  hey wow, if all of these people were to unite, we could vote out those that are fighting against the middle class.  We could vote out those that are protecting the 1%

      It's pretty easy to figure out MOST of the Republicans defend the 1% so I could not understand why the 99% could not just come up with a battle plan that would have thrown out a lot of Republicans.

      So, now I will go occupy my bathroom.

      "Hey, with religion you can't get just a little pregnant"

      by EarTo44 on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 06:18:24 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Occupy is a QUANTUM LEAP FORWARD (3+ / 0-)

        Occupy did not "blow it".  It was a huge step in the right direction.  That said, the right direction takes more than one step to arrive.

        We've only just begun.

        http://www.OcccupyAmerica.TV

        JOIN ME ON FACEBOOK at - www.Facebook.com/EricAllenBell

        by EricAllenBell on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 06:26:06 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Be sure to wake me up when it's time to vote. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          SquirrelWhisperer

          Oh, wait, I forgot, we at OWS aren't political.

          OK.. I am going to wish really big.

          "Hey, with religion you can't get just a little pregnant"

          by EarTo44 on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 06:30:06 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Is cynicism your contribution? (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            cotterperson, Bette Kibble

            How has voting been working out for us say over the past 30 years or so?  Not so good I'm thinking.

            What I am calling for in the article above which you have mischaracterized as "dreaming" is to shift from waiting for the powers that be to fix our problems for us to a mindset of personal accountability, personal responsibility and a fundamental shift in consciousness.

            If even a relatively small percentage of us can get that right, it will begin to take hold and affect the collective consciousness.

            Try it... or you could just sit on the sidelines and keep yelling "boo".

            JOIN ME ON FACEBOOK at - www.Facebook.com/EricAllenBell

            by EricAllenBell on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 06:37:14 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Had an interesting event this morning as an (3+ / 0-)

              example of positive energy vs negative energy:

              I was out shopping for necessities and as usual in early hours only 2 cashiers- a quick line and regular line-

              A fairly long line for the regular cashier. The lady being rung up had a BIG cart load and all kinds of price check issues, which is annoying but I've learned to just not engage with the looks etc. The next lady in front of me was impatient, fidgeting, tried to engage me in the tsk, tsking. I wouldn't look at her and just looked away, at magazine covers etc.
              When the first lady was finished she approached the second lady and said I didn't appreciate the way you looked at me and I'm sorry it took so long. The second lady was taken aback and said I didn't say anything! She then looked at me for agreement as I knew she hadn't said anything, but all I said was "Think Positive thoughts. Negative energy creates havoc, especially on cash registers." Which wasn't working properly. The cashier then said Yes the registers have been a bit off today. The two ladies then in agreement blamed the cash registers and smiled at each other apologizing. The second lady then touched my shoulder and said thanks for reminding me to be positive.
              The cashier gave me a big smile and I just kind of nodded and smiled back.

              I have always been aware of the energy we emit-can't wear wrist watches and when I'm in a bad mood I swear my computer always 'messes up'.

              "Time is for careful people, not passionate ones."

              "Life without emotions is like an engine without fuel."

              by roseeriter on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 06:50:10 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  Science is starting to catch up with the mystics (3+ / 0-)

                Consciousness is EVERYTHING.

                That said, it's mystery even to the mystics.  Books like "The Secret" seek to exploit the fact that consciousness affects form, but that book does so in a way that oversells and is mostly ignorant of how this phenomenon actually works.

                I don't think any of us know how exactly it works - but consciousness does affect form and that IS a scientific fact.

                JOIN ME ON FACEBOOK at - www.Facebook.com/EricAllenBell

                by EricAllenBell on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 07:06:28 AM PST

                [ Parent ]

    •  Taking "real action" before transformation (4+ / 0-)

      does not bring about "real" change.  It is merely heightened activity within an established pattern.

      Inward revolution is what creates TRUE meaningful and real outward revolution.

      JOIN ME ON FACEBOOK at - www.Facebook.com/EricAllenBell

      by EricAllenBell on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 06:24:47 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  We need some "heightened activity"... (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        SquirrelWhisperer

        ...and good analytical and strategic thinking to determine which patterns of action are most successful in bringing about the changes we desire to our economy, our society, and our politics.

        The people who don't have enough to eat, who are losing their homes, who are out of work, who live every day in insecurity, and who face the future of a changed climate, don't need you to have an "inward revolution"; they need food, homes, jobs, security, and action on climate change.

        Quite frankly, if people get fed or housed or employed, it doesn't make a damn bit of difference whether you've undergone an "inward revolution."

        You're talking about the top of Maslow's hierarchy of needs, while our nation's and our world's problems are near the bottom of it.

        There are too many real problems in the world, problems for which now is a crucial time of action, to justify spending time undergoing some kind of "transformation" beyond determining and taking effective action for justice, and developing the inner moral strength to see that action through to the end.

        "When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist." --Dom Helder Camara, archbishop of Recife

        by JamesGG on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 06:54:16 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  You are assuming I'm saying something else... (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          cotterperson, Bette Kibble

          No where in this article did I call for inaction.

          JOIN ME ON FACEBOOK at - www.Facebook.com/EricAllenBell

          by EricAllenBell on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 07:07:58 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  You make it clear... (0+ / 0-)

            ...that you consider "inward revolution" a prerequisite for "TRUE meaningful and real outward revolution."

            That sets up a pretty clear hierarchy of terms, such that those who have not yet undergone your "inward revolution" would be incapable of "TRUE meaningful and real outward revolution," and thus be incapable of effective action toward that goal.

            The person who is fed or employed really doesn't give a damn if those who bring him or her to that state have undergone an "inward revolution."

            Suppose a brother or a sister is without clothes and daily food. If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it? In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.

            "When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist." --Dom Helder Camara, archbishop of Recife

            by JamesGG on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 09:03:07 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  You're right... (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Bette Kibble, cotterperson

              In doesn't matter on the mundane level for a person who wishes not to break out of the prison, but rather to just have better prison conditions.  

              But if it is real freedom you are after, you have to honestly ask yourself who it is that is keeping you in bondage.

              JOIN ME ON FACEBOOK at - www.Facebook.com/EricAllenBell

              by EricAllenBell on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 10:29:46 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  It's not "the prison"... (0+ / 0-)

                ...that makes human beings require food, clothing, shelter, medical care, and occupation.

                It's basic reality.

                "The good news to a hungry person is bread.” --Bishop Desmond Tutu

                For those without food, housing, or employment, those are the things that are currently keeping them "in bondage"—and the injustice of their not having access to these basic necessities of life is keeping our culture in bondage.

                The solution to that problem isn't "enlightenment" or "balance" or anything else that's internal to the person—it's getting them food, housing, and jobs. Those are real, actual things that are tangible and objective and address unquestionable and universal human needs.

                Once we've solved that problem, then we'll be free to concern ourselves with "inward revolution" or whatever else you think we need.

                "When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist." --Dom Helder Camara, archbishop of Recife

                by JamesGG on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 11:08:22 AM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  Let me give you an example... (3+ / 0-)

                  I used to spend my money on things like living in a 5 star hotel, driving high end German cars, fancy dinners, etc.

                  At a certain point the interest I had in spirituality changed from a sort of flirtation to a deeper inquiry.  In the process of that inquiry I was and continue to be transformed.

                  Part of that transformation, for me personally, was to stop thinking that the world owed me something and to stop thinking about what I could get out of the world.  Since that time my energy has gone more and more in the opposite direction.

                  What money was left has gone into various projects that help others.

                  Is this sounding less new-agey to you now?

                  Fast forward a few years and I am close to being broke.  All of my time and energy is focused on making the contributions I can reducing the suffering of others and trying to help to build a better world.

                  This is an example of an inward revolution which became an outward revolution.

                  And the journey continues...

                  JOIN ME ON FACEBOOK at - www.Facebook.com/EricAllenBell

                  by EricAllenBell on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 11:27:19 AM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                •  Getting the basics is easy (3+ / 0-)

                  Seriously, why are people not getting their basic needs met? We have the resources, including person-power, to ensure that everyone is fat and happy.

                  Your answer is classic begging the question. Not "raising the question," but assuming the question in the answer.  Mr. Bell posits that in order to meet basic needs, we need to shift our attitude. You respond that what we need to do first is meet people's basic needs. That is begging the question, in both senses.

                  You seem to think that our failure to meet people's basic needs is simply a logistical problem, that we just need to figure out how to do it. We KNOW how to do it. We have the ability to do it. But we are not doing it.

                  And that is why we need a real inward revolution. Mr. Bell is correct, directing more energy at the problem in the same old way will ensure the same old results.

                  Of course, to some this will sound like preaching. Most people feel insulted when they think someone is telling them how to live, or even that they should examine the way they are living their lives.

                  But it is precisely how each of us, as individuals, is living our lives that is the problem. It is foolish to claim that, although the system we inhabit is broken, we need not examine our own psyches to discern the reason why it is broken.

                  All in all, your responses appear to be an attack on the very concept of introspection. Your solutions amount to "We need to do something, not think about things." But doing without thinking is what got us into this mess.

        •  My problem with your comment (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          AoT, cotterperson

          you juxtapose increased political activity and some sort of "inward revolution" as if those are mutually exclusive terms.

          It's not as if the material problems that you talke about (which are very real) don't turn into long term psychologogical and "spiritual" problems. And simply getting a job or enough food to eat or voting for the right person doesn't make those problems go away.

          •  spelling problems much, Kev (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            EricAllenBell, cotterperson

            oh, well, I can always blame on the caffeine

          •  It's not me who makes them mutually exclusive. (0+ / 0-)
            you juxtapose increased political activity and some sort of "inward revolution" as if those are mutually exclusive terms.

            By suggesting that "inward revolution" is a prerequisite for political or social activity, in openly saying that "TRUE meaningful and real outward revolution" can only be created by "inward revolution," the diarist makes them mutually exclusive.

            Those of us who have no desire to undertake "inward revolution," but who want to take strategic and pragmatic steps in order to further justice and combat the injustices that we all know are out there, seem to have no place in his vision.

            It's not as if the material problems that you talke about (which are very real) don't turn into long term psychologogical and "spiritual" problems. And simply getting a job or enough food to eat or voting for the right person doesn't make those problems go away.

            That's true, but I don't think that's as much about "enlightenment" or "inward revolution" as it is about applying best practices in the social, biological, and behavioral sciences to those individuals who need help.

            Moreover, those problems remain second-order problems; the person with a job or food is still better off than he or she was before he or she had those things, and the second-order psychological or spiritual problems resulting from the lack of food or a job aren't likely to be solved if the person doesn't have food or a job.

            "When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist." --Dom Helder Camara, archbishop of Recife

            by JamesGG on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 08:59:09 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Inward Revolution (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              cotterperson

              is not a pre-requisite for political or social revolution....However,everyone thinks they know the fix for our world to change....and it is all very different...sometimes it is just band-aids,and sometimes causes wars.,or horrific actions.(like in the bombing or killing of abortion doctors)......so going within raising our Consciousness and Realizing that we are One with the world and Are the world....We would come up with solutions that do not kill or hurt other people.We would all act with more Love. you,James already seem to have that love and Conscience , but i know different people that don't believe in helping anyone and are quite anti-social and the wars have gone on and on for hundreds of years.

          •  The spiritual problem... (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            cotterperson, Bette Kibble

            Begins the moment you are indoctrinated and ends as you break free of this indoctrination.

            JOIN ME ON FACEBOOK at - www.Facebook.com/EricAllenBell

            by EricAllenBell on Tue Jan 03, 2012 at 10:33:09 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

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