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View Diary: Protect IP/SOPA And The Impact It Could Have On Industries And Jobs (56 comments)

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  •  Opposing bad policy is not the same (3+ / 0-)

    as aiding what the bad policy claims to combat.

    I don't doubt that warrantless wiretaps makes it easier to find terrorists. I really don't. But it has a lot of other consequences. You're using the same sort of reasoning here.
    By opposing warrantless wiretaps, I don't enable terrorists. By opposing SOPA, I don't enable pirates.

    •  Ok... point taken (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      MasterKey, Ianb007

      I was being a little too hyperbolic, I suppose. However, I am really kind of frustrated by the pure bullshit and hyperbole that surrounds the opposition of these two bill... that are extremely important to someone like me.

      Most people have no idea what is actually in the bill... and there is a lot of people using falsehood to promote opposition. The bill does not in any way target sites like dkos, youtube, reddit, etc.

      Look... the government uses this type of power to seize property from drug dealers... from the day they are arrested... not after conviction. I don't see anyone complaining about that.

      •  Surprised you are so convinced (3+ / 0-)

        these bills will even make a dent in piracy. You think someone who uses Pirate Bay today, and knows how to configure and operate a Bit Torrent client, won't be able to figure out how to type 194.71.107.15 into a browser and access it anyway?

        What if I just set up an American site (piratebay.com or whatever) that links to that IP address, so the content is just one click away? Would that site then be subject to censorship?

        Censorship is such a heavy-handed (and slippery slope enabling) tactic, it's doomed to fail at combating something as innate to the web as file sharing. And destined to be abused for all kinds of purposes in the future if we start going down this route.

        •  Your censorship (0+ / 0-)

          is my solution. Personally, I don't see any sense of censorship in closing infringing sites anymore than I would in the police closing a crack house.

          I don't think that DNS is the correct way to handle it... but it WILL greatly reduce traffic to these infringing sites... personally, I think that the ip range should be blocked at the ISP level. They already do that for spammers...

          •   Open Letter From Internet Engineers (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Cassandra Waites, Brown Thrasher

            An Open Letter From Internet Engineers to the U.S. Congress  

            People smarter than me when it comes to security of the internet and the system that it runs on blocking is a bad idea.  

            In the letter linked above they seem to think that this type of blocking could have adverse effect on the security of internet and the underlying systems connecting to it.

          •  And if an American site (0+ / 0-)

            links to Pirate Bay? Shut it down too, huh?

            Oh wait I thought SOPA only applied to foreign sites.

            •  I think (1+ / 1-)
              Recommended by:
              Ianb007
              Hidden by:
              Brown Thrasher

              you had better read the bills again, mr. pirate

              •  Really? Which part did I get (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Brown Thrasher, Cassandra Waites

                wrong? Because I was under the impression SOPA did in fact criminalize linking to anything deemed as rogue site. It may sound ridiculous and unworkable, but that's only because the bill itself is ridiculous and unworkable.

                P.S. If I'm a pirate for arguing against this bill, then I guess I'm in good company considering the heads of Google, Wikipedia, Reddit and most tech companies oppose it. Apparently Tim Berners-Lee, Vint Cerf and Al Gore are pirates too, who knew?:)

                •  linking is not the issue (0+ / 0-)

                  Both bills do not say ANYTHING about linking to a site that has infringing content if the link is not related to the primary purpose of your site. They both plainly say that the site's primary purpose has to be infringement. Linking to a site with infringement isn't infringement... UNLESS the primary purpose of your site IS to infringe... say for example, a pirated movie torrent directory that primarily links to sites who have pirated movies... the primary purpose of your site is then to promote pirated content.

                  It is very easy to tell the primary purpose of at least 99% of actual sites by their content... that is why I pass judgement on those commercial file sharing sites that pay pirates to pirate.

                  •  Actually linking is indeed covered (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    Cassandra Waites, Brown Thrasher

                    by SOPA. There is a section that says that "search engines" will be forced to remove links to infringing sites.

                    Search engine is defined rather broadly as "a service made available via the Internet whose primary function is gathering and reporting, in response to a user query, indexed information or Web sites available elsewhere on the Internet."

                    Sites like Twitter, Flickr and Wikipedia (according to analysis by Wikipedia's legal team) could easily qualify as "search engines" under this definition:

                    Wikipedia arguably falls under the definition of an “Internet search engine,”[3] and, for that reason, a federal prosecutor could obtain a court order mandating that the Wikimedia Foundation remove links to specified “foreign infringing sites” or face at least contempt of court sanctions.[4]  The definition of “foreign infringing sites” is broad[5] and could well include legitimate sites that host mostly legal content, yet have other purported infringing content on their sites.

                    Therefore, under SOPA, Wikipedia (and every other major site that aggregates links and information) will be forced to spend their time scrubbing and disappearing links to (and content originating from) "rogue sites."

                    Of course, the internet blacklist you are advocating could easily grow to include hundreds of thousands (if not millions eventually) of foreign sites. What could possibly go wrong?

                    •  Reddit (3+ / 0-)

                      The Reddit General Manager Erik Marin, said something similar saying that

                      If SOPA passes in anything like it's current form, it would almost certainly mean the end of reddit. It may not happen overnight, but we have a very small staff (~11, mostly engineers), and even dealing with DMCA stuff is a big burden for us. SOPA would make running reddit near impossible. And we have access to great lawyers through our parent company. I can't imagine how smaller sites without those kind of resources could even attempt a go at it if SOPA passes.

                      The Myth That SOPA/PIPA Only Impact 'Foreign Sites'
                      •  volunteers... (1+ / 0-)
                        Recommended by:
                        Ianb007

                        reddit is a huge community with multiple mods per topic. Reddit General Manager Erik Marin is blowing smoke up your ass.

                        I am (and have been) an active member of reddit for two years now... just had my second cake day, as a matter of fact. I am well aware of how reddit works.

              •  Insult. HR. (0+ / 0-)

                Tell Congress: DON'T BREAK THE INTERNET!

                by Brown Thrasher on Tue Jan 10, 2012 at 05:09:50 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  you (0+ / 0-)

                  are what is wrong with the dkos user model.

                  •  Read the FAQ. (0+ / 0-)

                    You come in here spouting Hollywood talking points in support of a bill that's been crafted & supported by a ranking House Republican, then call anyone who disagrees with you a criminal.

                    The Daily Kos FAQ explicitly names that as Hide-able behavior. Don't like the house policies? Then take your pitch somewhere else.

                    Also, color me unsurprised that you just admitted that you'd like this to be a more censored & micromanaged site. The more you dig with such bullying remarks, the more you build the case against what you're supporting.

                    Tell Congress: DON'T BREAK THE INTERNET!

                    by Brown Thrasher on Tue Jan 10, 2012 at 05:51:20 PM PST

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  welcome to the site (0+ / 0-)

                      if you can't tell the difference between playing around with someone and calling them names then you have larger problem. Insulting someone means calling the actual names like motherfucker, stupid fuck, etc... read what I posted again... maybe then you will see the friendly sarcasm.... or maybe people don't talk to each other like that where you are from.

                      As far as accusing me of spouting"Hollywood talking points"... when someone is using talking points... they are unable to defend their position with anything other than spin and more talking points. If you read the whole comment thread you will find discussion.

                      I don't honestly give a flying squirrel shit about the HR you gave me... it's not the first one I have ever gotten and I am still a TU with higher mojo than you... I am able to have a candid conversation without playing this childish game.

                      •  So no F-bomb = no insult? Funny... (0+ / 0-)

                        ...how the dictionary seems to disagree with you.

                        Your little slanderous question-begging cheap shot — a variety of insult which you seem to have conveniently forgotten — directly attacked another poster's motives as criminal. This is disruptive behavior that is specifically forbidden by the FAQ as well as basic standards of polite society.

                        when someone is using talking points... they are unable to defend their position with anything other than spin and more talking points

                        Sounds like what you've offered throughout this comment thread.

                        Tell Congress: DON'T BREAK THE INTERNET!

                        by Brown Thrasher on Wed Jan 11, 2012 at 09:23:36 AM PST

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  you are a piece of work -- (0+ / 0-)

                          I sarcastically called him Mr. Pirate because he seemed to know all of the pirate sites on the internet.

                          Why don't you go play rules lawyer with someone else. Otherwise... fuck off.

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