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View Diary: The state of Virginia about to rape women, legally (63 comments)

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  •  Oops, just read it again (0+ / 0-)

    sorry, I see that it does fit the legal (and practical) definition of rape.. if one were to use the probe without consent, obviously. Nobody is requiring anybody to submit to the probe on a non-consenting person. They're requiring that women give consent to the probe in order to have an abortion. This is awful, it's surely unconstitutional, but it really isn't rape.

    •  Your above post didn't show (0+ / 0-)

      until I posted my reply.

      I stand by my post but am glad to see you caught that.

    •  If the consent is forced on you-- have this (8+ / 0-)

      ultrasound or bear the child--it is not actually consented to. I mean if a Rapist holds a knife at your throat and forces you to tell him you ant him, that doesn't make the act any less rape.

      The last time we mixed religion and politics people got burned at the stake.

      by irishwitch on Wed Feb 15, 2012 at 10:55:49 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  Coerced "consent" is not voluntary consent (4+ / 0-)

        These nut jobs in VA are forgetting that little distinction.

        These "exams" are analogous to a person in a position of authority coercing a much younger person or a person of lesser "status" into having sex with them.

        One example would be teacher/professor coercing a student into having sex with them.  Doesn't matter if it's a college-age student over 18 or a high school student under 18.  Their positions are unequal and "consent" always carries with it some implied threat of the person of lesser status being treated unfavorably if they do not "consent" to the sex.

        Another example is doctor/counselor-patient relationships where the patient is in no position to "consent" to sex (or anything else).

        The list goes on and on.

        In the case of VA, the proposed law aims to punish a woman if she does not "consent" to this invasion of her body.  Ergo, it is rape because she is in no mental, emotional, or physical condition to voluntarily consent to the penetration by object because of the unequal status of the ones seeking the penetration and her position as supplicant for a medical procedure.  It's still rape because by definition no real voluntary consent can be given.

        Of course, the intent is to punish a woman one way or another, which is the objective of this law (if passed), so coerced or faux willing consent is irrelevant.

        I'm sick of attempts to steer this nation from principles evolved in The Age of Reason to hallucinations derived from illiterate herdsmen. ~ Crashing Vor

        by NonnyO on Wed Feb 15, 2012 at 05:03:44 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  it's consent under threat = coercion (6+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Onomastic, lineatus, kyril, NonnyO, LSophia, splashy


      It falls under the same catagory as forceable sexual consent.  If I am saying I will not allow you to do something unless you "consent" to have sex with me .. that's not consent, that's  coercion .. and it's still rape

      I will not allow you to have an abortion without unless you have a medically UNNECESSARY invasive ultrasound is not consent it's coercion = rape

      Bumper sticker seen on I-95; "Stop Socialism" my response: "Don't like socialism? GET OFF the Interstate highway!"

      by Clytemnestra on Wed Feb 15, 2012 at 11:42:23 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  neil, nothing personal but I'm assuming you're a (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      kyril, NonnyO, LSophia, splashy

      guy, based on your name.  And until men are forced to get a medically unnecessary anal-probe ultrasound before they can get the treatment they're seeking, I don't think you're going to understand how intrusive this is.

      This is quite simply about putting women in their place, and erecting as many barriers to a legal procedure as as they can.

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