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View Diary: What if Barack Obama weren't a leftist? (278 comments)

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  •  You have proven nothing. (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    chuckvw, Claudius Bombarnac

    Maybe you should post a diary or something.

    "I've seen the flame of hope among the hopeless/ And that was truly the biggest heartbreak of all" -- Bruce Cockburn

    by Cassiodorus on Fri Mar 30, 2012 at 02:12:17 PM PDT

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    •  Let's do a side by side comparison (0+ / 0-)

      So LBJ's views on gay rights were to the left of Obama's? You really want to try and make that case?

      See, the problem with you is that when you leave the Occupy camp, you're confronted with these pesky things like history, and fact, and you're bubble just pops.

      Try opening up a history book. You're way in over your head here.

      •  Oh, I historicize. (0+ / 0-)

        You just compare, as if all historical figures lived in the same era.

        Should we compare Thomas Jefferson's views on civil rights with the elder Bush's?  Of course not.  

        "I've seen the flame of hope among the hopeless/ And that was truly the biggest heartbreak of all" -- Bruce Cockburn

        by Cassiodorus on Fri Mar 30, 2012 at 05:50:07 PM PDT

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        •  Of course... (0+ / 0-)

          I shouldn't have to tell this to a patronizing, condescending pompous ass who's telling me I'm "in way over my head"...

          "I've seen the flame of hope among the hopeless/ And that was truly the biggest heartbreak of all" -- Bruce Cockburn

          by Cassiodorus on Fri Mar 30, 2012 at 05:51:23 PM PDT

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          •  You're right (0+ / 0-)

            You said it yourself: Different eras.

            Barack Obama is far more left than, say, FDR or LBJ on issues of race and equality and civil liberties (yes, civil liberties). But he may not be as left on economic policy.

            You see the trap you've fallen into with this sophomoric diary?

            You're comparing the leftist economic beliefs of the progressive era, when socialism was a mainstream party affiliation, with the leftist beliefs on equality and civil rights of the modern era. You can't do that.

            Barack Obama is firmly a leftist of the modern era.

            •  Nope. (0+ / 0-)

              The "leftist economic beliefs in the progressive era" were beliefs which promoted the possibility of a universe of greater economic equality.  The fact that neither Obama nor Congress believes in resurrecting such a universe into the realm of possibility does not make either Obama or Congress "left," not even "for this era."

              Thomas Jefferson, who owned slaves and raped at least one of them, still believed in the possibility of a universe of human equality, because he believed that slavery was eventually going to come to an end.  Those things don't make him a "conservative" in the same sense that Barack Obama is in fact a conservative because he strives to maintain the corporate profit rate in an era of declining global growth, and because he strives to maintain the military-industrial complex in an era of its fading relevance.

              Your idea of "left" is that Presidents who were born on third base should be credited for hitting triples.  Leftist achievement, not inherited legacy, makes people leftists.

              LBJ's signing of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 promoted progressive social change in a way in which no act of Barack Obama's ever did.  The fact that Barack Obama came to the Presidency long after LBJ, and with no apartheid regime to remedy in the US, does not change that.

              "I've seen the flame of hope among the hopeless/ And that was truly the biggest heartbreak of all" -- Bruce Cockburn

              by Cassiodorus on Sat Mar 31, 2012 at 02:49:37 PM PDT

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