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View Diary: Bill McKibben on the End of Growth (151 comments)

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  •  Redistribution, too (11+ / 0-)

    Putting limits on growth forces us to confront the issue of the distribution of wealth. And that is why pro-growth policies and political arguments are so appealing to those forces that oppose any kind of redistribution.

    Growth becomes the only hope for a way out of poverty for most of the world's population.

    Those of us who desire to limit growth must provide arguments that appeal the the have-nots, and paint an appealing vision of a world of limited growth in energy use and population.

    Skepticism of all the elite institutions, not trust, is what required for successful leadership in this era. Digby

    by coral on Sun Apr 08, 2012 at 12:05:20 PM PDT

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    •  Not desire limit to growth... (21+ / 0-)

      I think the crucial point McKibben is making is that it's not that he desires a limit to growth---he's pointing out that it's reality, whether anyone likes it or not.  And that pursuing it further is a counterproductive exercise in futility.

      Growth is most definitely not the only hope for those in poverty, and he actually devotes a section of his book to exactly this topic.  But going back a few decades, E.F. Schumacher described how there are places in the so-called developing world (I don't like the term, because it implies that our industrial society is somehow more "developed") that are materially poor in the measures the industrial world uses and yet are well off in many other ways.  The Indian state of Kerala is an example: high levels of education, health, and general well-being, but very little in the way of industry. - thoughts on energy, the environment, and society.

      by barath on Sun Apr 08, 2012 at 12:11:12 PM PDT

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    •  We are not going to have to do anything... (6+ / 0-)

      to convince anyone of anything, for the simple reason that we are not going to have any real control over the coming decline.

      Between Climate Change and Peak Oil/Resources, we are all, the Have Nots, the Haves, and the Have Mores, are all going to be in the same boat.

      Money and "stuff" are not going to be worth much when one is hungry or thirsty because the aquifers have dried up and the droughts hit our fertile land. Or the food cannot be grown, harvested, prepared/packaged, and shipped to our nearest MegaStore because there is limited fuel to do so.

      In fact, I submit the "poor" will be the new rich because none of this will be new to them. They already know how to survive with little. The Haves and Have Mores are going to be lost without their lattes and MTV.

      "Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of the cancer cell." ~ Edward Abby

      by SaraBeth on Sun Apr 08, 2012 at 12:31:24 PM PDT

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