Skip to main content

View Diary: Catholic bishop compares Barack Obama to Hitler (253 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  Really? You can't? I can't believe that there (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    rbird, OldDragon

    was a Vatican II or that it really stood for anything.

    That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

    by enhydra lutris on Tue Apr 17, 2012 at 05:05:33 PM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  Sorry, you must be too young. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      enhydra lutris

      Keep in mind that I am not a trinitarian, or anything close to a person believing in a "sky god" that rains down punishment if you don't believe the Nicene Creed, a document written by men. I check in with the Beatitudes, Parables, Sermon on the Mount, related passages, the Lord's Prayer (up to but not incl. the doxlology) and the Letter of James. Got it?

      Given the trendlines for the RCC literally from 392 when Emperor Theodosius, the temporal and spiritual head of the Roman Empire, began consolidating Catholic control, effectively stopping all pagan worship, scientific research and opposition to the Nicene Creed. Thus all ancient traditions were either abolished or rolled into Catholic ones (Saturnalia into Xmas and New Year into Easter) and new traditions killed off (Arian unitarians). And from that point, the Dark Ages or Medievalism held sway over Western European culture, burning volumes of books, novels, and scientific papers, until only those sanctioned by the RCC were allowed to survive. True that in dark corners of monastic libraries and in places outside the control of Roman Catholic clerics important documents such as Lucretius' DE RERUM NATURA survived (found in 1417 by Poggio Bracchiolini) to inspire the Renaissance. When those who resisted the RCC in sufficient numbers arose, armies backed by the Pope or actual Papal armies were called into to indiscriminately decimate those movements (The Cathars). The Orthodox Churches finally had enough with the Roman Pope and split in 1054 CE. Protestants, starting with Luther, tried to reform the RCC, but later gave up and split as well in 1521. Together with the inability to hold onto power and the resistance to conversion of Jews, Muslims, Romani and other groups judged to be resistant to Papal control, the Holy Inquisition (1231-1860 CE) was formed to maintain dogma and obedience. The Holy Inquisition exists today in the form of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, the last leader of which was Pope Ratzinger. There you go.

      So VATICAN II WAS A TRUE STEP AWAY from this trendline, only to be rejected, retracted and is currently being buried so much so that you might not know what it really was. Popes John XXIII, Paul VI, and John-Paul 1 (not 2) were the ones who tried to bring about changes and relaxations of very medieval and very un-Jesus-like beliefs. Movements such as Liberation Theology (see Gustavo Gutierrez), Catholic Worker Movement (see Dorothy Day), religious orders who focus on the poor rather than on the rich, and lay people who focus on Works rather than Faith are beneficiaries of Vatican II.  All are under attack by the Pope, Bishops, Priests, "traditional Catholics" and the Papal Electors.

      That's now almost done with, given the decrees of JP2 and the current Pope Ratzinger. They have successfully buried Vatican II, which is why you don't know the history and post as you do.

      Ugh. --UB.

      "Daddy, every time a bell rings, a Libertaria­n picks up his Pan Am tickets for the Libertaria­n Paradise of East Somalia!"

      by unclebucky on Fri Apr 20, 2012 at 05:27:26 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  I am aware of the history you recite, but I've (0+ / 0-)

        always been a bit suspicious that the announced Vatican II was more PR than reality. History seems to bear that out too. The great ecumenicalism simply amounts to not declaring physical war on other sects, which the Vatican hasn't had the muscle to do for ages anyway. Oh yeah, they forgive the jews - they don't retract the calumny, they merely forgive the jews, etc., etc. I see it as cover and nothing more.

        That, in its essence, is fascism--ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. -- Franklin D. Roosevelt --

        by enhydra lutris on Fri Apr 20, 2012 at 05:52:27 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site