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View Diary: Jeralyn Merrit's report on Zimmerman discovery docs (158 comments)

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  •  Define "accosts." (4+ / 0-)

    There's a big difference between following and asking what you are doing there, on the one hand, and pulling a gun and/or hitting someone, on the other hand. The first probably does not justify physically hitting someone; the second probably does.  

    There's no evidence, as far as I can see, as to what happened here.  

    •  I know (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      buddabelly, VClib

      Accosting could be either scenario you suggest, and both are very different. And we don't know what happened. And we may never know. In fact probably will never know.

      from a bright young conservative: “I’m watching my first GOP debate…and WE SOUND LIKE CRAZY PEOPLE!!!!”

      by Catte Nappe on Fri May 18, 2012 at 08:59:49 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  From The Police report, it sounds like Z never (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      FiredUpInCA

      identified himself to the kid.

      "Rick Perry talks a lot and he's not very bright. And that's a combination I like in Republicans." --- James Carville

      by LaurenMonica on Fri May 18, 2012 at 09:18:26 AM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  interesting but irrelevant. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        VClib

        The fact that a person you don't know walks behind you and says, "What are you doing here" does not provoke the use of physical force by you.    

        The prosecution is going to have to show more than that to argue to a judge or jury that Z provoked the physical force.

        •  Didnt seem irrelevant to the investigator who wrot (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          FiredUpInCA

          e that the tragedy was 'avoidable' if Zimmerman had stayed in the car or identified himself to the kid therefor he wanted Zimmerman to be charged for manslaughter at the time.

          Since Trayvon cant speak for himself, every detail is relevant.

          "Rick Perry talks a lot and he's not very bright. And that's a combination I like in Republicans." --- James Carville

          by LaurenMonica on Fri May 18, 2012 at 09:58:43 AM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  I will clarify. (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            VClib

            I meant as a legal matter, the fact that he did not identify himself when he asked "what are you doing" does not constitute "provoking the use of force," as far as I know.  (I'm a lawyer, so I look at things from the legal angle.

            And, obviously, the investigator was speaking from a practical perspective of what happened, not from the perspective of whether there's potential criminal liability, since the fact that the tragedy was "avoidable" if Z had stayed in his car does not give rise to criminal liability.  That's not the legal standard.  

            Factually, the tragedy could have been avoided if lots of things had not happened -- Z had not gone out that night, Z had stayed in his car, M had not gone out for Skittles, M had not chosen that route home . . .

            Generally, a "but for" test -- "but for x, y would not have happened" is not relevant to criminal liability unless the "x" thing is, itself, against the law.  Neither Z's getting out his car, nor M's walking through that neighborhood, was a crime.  So, legally, you can't say "it's your fault this happened because if you (hadn't got out of the car, hadn't taken that route home), this wouldn't have happened."

            •  According to Joy- Ann Reid, Zimmerman changed his (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              FiredUpInCA

              story numerous time prompting the investigators to be suspicious. Apparently he first told that that Trayvon tried to rob him, then changed the story then said told them
              that he couldnt remember what prompted the confrontation.

              But we will learn more once the police transcripts will be fully released to the public. Until then we are all speculating

              "Rick Perry talks a lot and he's not very bright. And that's a combination I like in Republicans." --- James Carville

              by LaurenMonica on Fri May 18, 2012 at 10:17:52 AM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  It will be interesting to see if there's any (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                VClib, Neuroptimalian

                evidence of that.  There have been many news stories bandied about, and (as in any high profile case) it's probably a mistake to believe everything that anybody reports.  That's why this evidence release is getting attention -- because it's not just another news report.  

                •  Joy-Ann Reid is reliable she has been on this case (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  FiredUpInCA

                  eveb before the case got National Coverage. She has her sources.

                  "Rick Perry talks a lot and he's not very bright. And that's a combination I like in Republicans." --- James Carville

                  by LaurenMonica on Fri May 18, 2012 at 10:58:19 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  I don't automatically believe what you say (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    VClib, Neuroptimalian

                    she said.  A news report is not evidence. Somebody has got to be willing to stand up in court and say that under oath.  

                    Do you have a link to the story where she says that?  Does she identify the source of that information?  

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