Skip to main content

View Diary: Some Recent Daily Kos Comics Go Against Site's Mission (280 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  In other words it's fine to call for people to be (12+ / 0-)

    killed as long as someone in power does the killing and the people being killed are a long way away.  I'm not especially happy about that.  I find it to be grossly hypocritical.

    There revolution will not be televised. But it will be blogged, a lot. Probably more so than is necessary.

    by AoT on Thu May 24, 2012 at 02:32:13 PM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  Not really. (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Mets102, volleyboy1, KayCeSF, Unit Zero

      Say we have actionable proof that someone in Yemen is planning to carry out an attack against civilians tomorrow. You're the Commander-in-Chief. What do you do?

      Your options are...

      A) Avoid conflict and hope it doesn't happen.

      B) Hope Yemen takes care of it.

      C) Send ground troops there and hope they don't get killed and nobody gets killed in a shootout.

      D) Send a drone to execute a targeted killing.

      That's the type of thing we're dealing with. I'd much rather do something an prevent an attack than do nothing, and try to reduce casualties in the process.

      Facebook
      Up-to-date weather forecasts and information at State of the Skies.

      by weatherdude on Thu May 24, 2012 at 02:54:37 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

      •  The answer you gave to that was "Yes" (6+ / 0-)

        not "not really."

        It is fine as long as they're far away and the people in power tell us they have good reasons.

        There revolution will not be televised. But it will be blogged, a lot. Probably more so than is necessary.

        by AoT on Thu May 24, 2012 at 03:10:22 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  If we have actionable evidence that someone (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Mets102, KayCeSF, Unit Zero

          is going to attack us, what do we do...just sit here and wait for them to do it, then issue a strongly worded statement and hope it makes them have a change in heart?

          I don't get it. What should we do to eliminate an immediate threat of an attack?

          Facebook
          Up-to-date weather forecasts and information at State of the Skies.

          by weatherdude on Thu May 24, 2012 at 03:58:10 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  So you support the use of violence? n/t (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            chipmo

            There revolution will not be televised. But it will be blogged, a lot. Probably more so than is necessary.

            by AoT on Thu May 24, 2012 at 04:29:58 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  When necessary... Yes. (4+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              AoT, Mets102, weatherdude, Unit Zero

              "'Touch it dude' - President Barack Obama"

              by volleyboy1 on Thu May 24, 2012 at 04:44:18 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  When you see it as necessary (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Shawn Russell, chipmo

                Which is not always true.

                There revolution will not be televised. But it will be blogged, a lot. Probably more so than is necessary.

                by AoT on Thu May 24, 2012 at 05:57:26 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  each of us can only go by what we see. (3+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  volleyboy1, Mets102, Unit Zero

                  The fact that you may see it as unnecessary doesn't make your view more true.

                  "Okay, until next time. Keep sending me your questions, and I will make fun of you... I mean, answer them." - Strong Bad

                  by AaronInSanDiego on Thu May 24, 2012 at 09:16:00 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Pretend you're one of the Yemeni citizens (2+ / 0-)
                    Recommended by:
                    AaronInSanDiego, PhilJD

                    of Majala who survived the U.S. strike in 2009.

                    On December 17, the Yemeni government announced that it had conducted a series of strikes against an Al Qaeda training camp in the village of al Majala in Yemen’s southern Abyan province, killing a number of Al Qaeda militants. As the story spread across the world, Shaye traveled to al Majala. What he discovered were the remnants of Tomahawk cruise missiles and cluster bombs, neither of which are in the Yemeni military’s arsenal. He photographed the missile parts, some of them bearing the label “Made in the USA,” and distributed the photos to international media outlets. He revealed that among the victims of the strike were women, children and the elderly. To be exact, fourteen women and twenty-one children were killed. Whether anyone actually active in Al Qaeda was killed remains hotly contested. After conducting his own investigation, Shaye determined that it was a US strike. The Pentagon would not comment on the strike and the Yemeni government repeatedly denied US involvement. But Shaye was later vindicated when Wikileaks released a US diplomatic cable that featured Yemeni officials joking about how they lied to their own parliament about the US role, while President Saleh assured Gen. David Petraeus that his government would continue to lie and say “the bombs are ours, not yours.”
                    I can see why someone would think that the War on Terror is a War on Islam.  If I lived there, I would definitely ask myself is "terrorism" is necessary.

                    Fortunately for us, most muslims do not think like Americans.

                    The bourgeoisie had better watch out for me, all throughout this so called nation. We don't want your filthy money, we don't need your innocent bloodshed, we just want to end your world. ~H.R.

                    by chipmo on Fri May 25, 2012 at 05:49:44 AM PDT

                    [ Parent ]

              •  Exactly. (4+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                Mets102, KayCeSF, volleyboy1, Unit Zero

                Only when it's necessary. I'd rather see five dead in a drone strike than a hundred dead in a terrorist attack because we sat on our hands. What about the kids and other innocent men and women who die in terrorist attacks? The street runs both ways.

                Facebook
                Up-to-date weather forecasts and information at State of the Skies.

                by weatherdude on Thu May 24, 2012 at 05:57:34 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  And you assume that the president. and I don't (0+ / 0-)

                  mean Obama necessarily, will always be able to know when it's appropriate.  Because giving the president the right to kill people with drones means you give Romney the right to do that if he wins.  It means that you think that Bush had that right.  It means that you think that reagan had that right.  This isn't about Obama, it's about the office of the president.  And you want that office to have the power to kill american citizens without oversight.

                  There revolution will not be televised. But it will be blogged, a lot. Probably more so than is necessary.

                  by AoT on Thu May 24, 2012 at 10:05:02 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

        •  you're twisting peoples words and meanings (5+ / 0-)

          you don't get to tell other kossacks what they mean when they say something. You can disagree but pretending you don't understand and supplying your own definition is wrong.

          In many cases using drones is actually saving lives so should we say you advocate baby murder because you are against drones? If the choice is between an invasion and another war or using a drone then drones are the right choice. Invasions and war would obviously cause more innocents to be killed, are you for killing more civilians by opposing drones? By your own logic you are, no matter what your words say. Get it? No matter how you answer we have a right to interpet your words however we want to and call you a baby killer or a supporter of violence in violation of the "rules"?

          America could have chosen to be the worlds doctor, or grocer. We choose instead to be her policeman. pity

          by cacamp on Thu May 24, 2012 at 04:23:46 PM PDT

          [ Parent ]

          •  Bombing people is violence (5+ / 0-)

            Killing people is violence.

            Is this in question?

            If I said we should bomb a republican party office that would rightfully be denounced as violence because it's bombing stuff.  Somehow bombing things in other countries becomes not violence?  I'm not twisting anyone's words.  I'm showing them that they too promote violence, whether they want to call it that or not.

            There revolution will not be televised. But it will be blogged, a lot. Probably more so than is necessary.

            by AoT on Thu May 24, 2012 at 04:28:49 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  you are advocating killing civilians and children (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Unit Zero, volleyboy1

              I told you we get to interpet your words, so it don't matter what you say just like you interpeted the other commenters words. You are advocating not using the less violent method of killing hence you are advocationg violence against civilians and children. I wish you would stop breaking the dkos rules against advocating violence. I'd Hr it but I'd run out of HR's if I did to all of you who do such things.

              In reality I just hope you can try to understand that when someone says "no" you don't get to say 'that means yes'. Get it?

              America could have chosen to be the worlds doctor, or grocer. We choose instead to be her policeman. pity

              by cacamp on Thu May 24, 2012 at 04:56:56 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

          •  A choice between an invasion and drones (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            chipmo

            is a choice between two different types of violence.

            There revolution will not be televised. But it will be blogged, a lot. Probably more so than is necessary.

            by AoT on Thu May 24, 2012 at 04:29:31 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  that's true (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Unit Zero, volleyboy1

              but some of us believe less killing is better and sometimes Presidents must make a choice between the two.

              America could have chosen to be the worlds doctor, or grocer. We choose instead to be her policeman. pity

              by cacamp on Thu May 24, 2012 at 04:59:10 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  This isn't about presidents (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                chipmo

                You admit that you are fine with violence in the right context?  You admit that violence is fine when it's justified by the government?

                I got HRed for saying that people had the right to defend themselves against the police because that was violence.  I just want some honesty here.

                There revolution will not be televised. But it will be blogged, a lot. Probably more so than is necessary.

                by AoT on Thu May 24, 2012 at 09:59:26 PM PDT

                [ Parent ]

                •  I think the argument was that (1+ / 0-)
                  Recommended by:
                  Mets102

                  if you support non-violence then you support non-violence on all sides not just the side you oppose. If you suggest people use violence against the police but that the police must not use violence back then you can't call yourself non-violent.

                  I didn't HR you (as you know) but, I do believe that was the argument. Either you support violence or not. There is no "half baby" in this one.

                  "'Touch it dude' - President Barack Obama"

                  by volleyboy1 on Fri May 25, 2012 at 10:08:19 AM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

      •  Say we don't (9+ / 0-)

        have actionable intelligence and we don't have the slightest idea who the targets are, but they have suspicious behavior.

        That's how we do it now, weatherdude.

        Read about John Brennan's signature strikes.


        "Justice is a commodity"

        by joanneleon on Thu May 24, 2012 at 07:42:09 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site