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View Diary: #ThisMachineKillsFascists an Observation About Blackbloc and the Future (122 comments)

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  •  Why do you think you can separate out the (9+ / 0-)

    "isolated incidents" "crazies" and "blood thirsty gutter punks"?  Why do you get to call them "infiltrators"?  There has to be some ownership of the people you draw into your group and who act under the auspices of your flag.  And in the end how can you claim an "overall" victory when those very people have diminished the effectiveness of the people who do take a responsible part in peaceful protest?  In by my opinion BB just refuses to accept responsibility for the problems they cause real protestors and takes credit for the parts they want to. It is an immature and socially irresponsible practice.

    “You can only become truly accomplished at something you love. Don't make money your goal. Instead, pursue the things you love doing, and then do them so well that people can't take their eyes off you...” - Maya Angelou

    by stellaluna on Mon May 28, 2012 at 04:12:36 AM PDT

    [ Parent ]

    •  I am a sovereign individual (0+ / 0-)

      I don't have to own anything.

      I accept my actions, which are non-violent.

      There isn't one Occupy flag, and pretending there is, is ridiculous. We have to undo the myth of homogenization and unity, where we have difference and dissensus.

      I can claim overall victory for the street demonstrations in Chicago because I saw the BB defend us, journalists, streamers, etc.

      BB can be a self-involved ego-fest, I'm not denying that, I'm not denying that sometimes it's a means to shirk responsibility, but that doesn't mean that when it's tactically used correctly, it's a bad thing.

      I'm not advocating a carte blanche BB, but a very specific style, and most of my readers seem to not get that, and that's frustrating.

      •  That is because it does so much damage to (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        rcnewton

        groups that don't deserve it.  And you have confused the concept of ownership of things with ownership of personal actions. Black Bloc won't take ownership of the grief they cause and try to obfuscate that grief through circular logic about diversity and individualism. But the fact is that Black Bloc is entirely parasitic in nature. The "good" that you see from black bloc actors could all be done without the selfish adherence to the bad. But it never is. So like any parasite, they destroy the host. Just because individually they may be good people capable of doing good things doesn't mean that the group and the concept is good.

        As far as a particular style that is where you have fallen into the myth of Black Bloc.. That is, that you can choose only the parts you like and pretend the other parts don't involve you. When you promote Black Bloc you promote the whole. To do otherwise is avoid your own personal responsibility. If you don't adhere to the whole thing then find or start something that you do completely believe in.

        “You can only become truly accomplished at something you love. Don't make money your goal. Instead, pursue the things you love doing, and then do them so well that people can't take their eyes off you...” - Maya Angelou

        by stellaluna on Mon May 28, 2012 at 03:42:49 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  Black Bloc (0+ / 0-)
          As far as a particular style that is where you have fallen into the myth of Black Bloc.. That is, that you can choose only the parts you like and pretend the other parts don't involve you. When you promote Black Bloc you promote the whole. To do otherwise is avoid your own personal responsibility. If you don't adhere to the whole thing then find or start something that you do completely believe in.
          I advocate blackbloc as a defensive tactic, and I think it works. It's not about the whole or the parts, just because I appreciate the value of something doesn't mean I automatically check every box just because. Imposing party line logic onto my choices as an individual doesn't actually react to what I'm saying, but picking and choosing what to react to. Notice msot people haven't even commented on the second part of the article.
          •  That's because the two cant be read separately. (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            rcnewton

            And I appreciate what you seem to be trying to do which is to find something commendable about a group that you didn't realize previously. But you can't separate out the good things about Black Bloc from the bad. The fact is that the bad does so much damage it overrides the good.  I don't doubt that some of the Black Bloc folk you met were honorable and brave. But the fact is that when we are dealing with movements that purport to speak for a group of people all of the actions matter. Not just the good ones. Those people should disassociate themselves from Black Bloc if they don't approve of the tactics. If they are committed to peaceful change there is a place for them. They let the violent members diminish their own message and presence.

            “You can only become truly accomplished at something you love. Don't make money your goal. Instead, pursue the things you love doing, and then do them so well that people can't take their eyes off you...” - Maya Angelou

            by stellaluna on Mon May 28, 2012 at 06:20:11 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

            •  That's a fair observation (0+ / 0-)

              I don't agree with your solution, but the observation is fair.

              Again, in my opinion Bloc isn't about violence, it's about self-defense from the surveillance state.

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