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View Diary: Using Right-Wing Talking Points to Achieve Left-Wing Goals (151 comments)

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  •  That's a great tactic. (4+ / 0-)

    And yes, many of their beliefs are just that - trivial crap.

    My point here is that we can use their trivial crap to make them support important, real change. To put it bluntly, I'm asking for people to find ways to use their own memes and frames to trick them into enacting progressive goals. bkamr found one way; let's find more.

    Science can tell you how to clone a dinosaur. Humanities explains why this is a bad idea.

    by Killer of Sacred Cows on Sat Jun 30, 2012 at 04:49:01 PM PDT

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    •  I think you are right. My challenge is ..... (3+ / 0-)

      that it assumes that there is a rational actor on the other side of the table.  From my experience, that is a big assumption though you know that there have to be some who can actually listen to reason.

      Usually, I encounter what I refer to as "read memory only".  They can't absorb any information that does not fit into their ideology.  Still, you have to try your approach.  For electoral purposes, you do not need to reach all of them.  Just a few percentage points to get rid of the legislative gridlock so that real change becomes possible.

      Here is one.  How can a healthy population not be a job creator.  Sick working parents out of the home or in the home will not boost GDP.

      How can investment in the infrastructure not be a job creator.

      Conversely, how can a crumbling infrastructure be a job creator.

      How can hunger be a job creator.

      In sum, if this helps, illness, hunger and a crumbling infrastructure do not create jobs.

      •  The rational actor is a myth (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Matt Z, potatohead

        Especially when we are dealing with ideologues. They can't see past their own memes to hear our points logically. That's why I advocate using THEIR memes to get our points in past their ideological barriers, to hit them in the gut, in the emotions, where they live. That will get their attention. Then we can start talking them out of their beliefs... but we have to get them to listen first.

        Science can tell you how to clone a dinosaur. Humanities explains why this is a bad idea.

        by Killer of Sacred Cows on Sat Jun 30, 2012 at 06:24:43 PM PDT

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        •  I still have a hard time coming up with anything. (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Killer of Sacred Cows, Matt Z

          Maybe it is because the right wing is so desperate to reaffirm itself that even using their own talking points to solicit their support for a progressive agenda probably has a very slim potential audience.  Still you have to try.

          Since the economy appears to be the biggest hot button this election cycle I think, that is where my mind focuses.

          They often refer to business as the goose that lays the golden egg so stop regulating them.  Maybe point out the goose that lays the golden egg is the environment and the infrastructure.  Stop strip mining our ability to generate GDP for broad based prosperity.

          Save free markets  from the red menace.  Main street them.  Don't Wall Street them.

          Liberty isn't free.  That is why we have taxes.

          National security is critical.  It requires and army, a healthy nation and a well educated populace.

          I have a feeling that you will find your best ideas from that George Lakoff (sp?) gentlemen who wrote Don't think of an Elephant.

          •  Which is why I mentioned him in this diary. (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            TheOpinionGuy, potatohead

            Yes, Lakoff (and Jonathan Haidt, another one that was mentioned in a thread) are awesome at providing research-based, evidence-based answers to the question "how do we get into their heads?"

            potatohead has just published a diary which demonstrates how we can, once we've gotten into their heads, then turn their memes back on them and shame them into awareness. My point with this diary is we have to get into their heads FIRST. Once we've pried their minds open, then we can dump in the bleach to clean out the racist, sexist, bigoted crap they carry around in there. But we can't get their minds to open using left-wing memes.

            Science can tell you how to clone a dinosaur. Humanities explains why this is a bad idea.

            by Killer of Sacred Cows on Sat Jun 30, 2012 at 07:05:05 PM PDT

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            •  This is about triggers. (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Killer of Sacred Cows

              Seriously.  They have politicized damn near everything.  One last frontier I know of is IP related things, and even that is starting to be laced with triggers.

              Two things I do:

              1.  Avoid labels of nearly all kinds as often as possible, and in particular when I am doing policy advocacy.  When we can express who we are using common words known to all, we actually understand who we are and others can see that.  It's attractive and compelling.

              2.  Highlight the trigger words and ask them what they mean, then ask them to re-express the garbage in other terms, usually framed as questions I pose to them with the intent of "really getting where they are coming from"

              This builds awareness of the politicization and over time, it becomes distasteful as many people admire individuality.  Highlighting group think tends to get people motivated to differentiate.

              A door can open then.  It does not open very wide, but it does open.

              I am eager to try your "use their meme" approach the next time I've got that door open, ideally after I've secured some quiet by personifying the bully in the room first.

              These tactical discussions are very interesting to me.  If I had a do over, I would be a sociologist as I've found a keen interest in how people work just as much as I am a technical type.  Wierd combo for sure.  

              But, I hate them too, because I really do want to interact with the people, not their dogma...

              ***Be Excellent To One Another***
              IF THEY ARE GOING TO SCREW THE PEOPLE, MAKE THEM OWN IT.

              by potatohead on Sun Jul 01, 2012 at 09:57:32 AM PDT

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      •  You are full of these! (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Killer of Sacred Cows

        Read only zealots!

        Another added to the toybox.  Nice!

        ***Be Excellent To One Another***
        IF THEY ARE GOING TO SCREW THE PEOPLE, MAKE THEM OWN IT.

        by potatohead on Sun Jul 01, 2012 at 09:50:40 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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