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View Diary: The most important Coming Out story of the year (147 comments)

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  •  I really don't get your point. (1+ / 0-)
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    FogCityJohn

    On the one hand, you seem to be arguing to get rid of labels such as "gay", "straight" and "bi-sexual", yet then you hit us up with

    "Make no mistake about it, I like men and am not bisexual."
    I'm sorry, you don't want to be labeled but then you go out of your way to label yourself and make it clear to us in no uncertain terms how you should be labeled?

    You also give us this

    "I used to tell people, I am only a homosexual when I am in bed."
      I am really glad you don't use that one anymore because I find it really insulting.   It implies there is something wrong with being gay that must be hidden in the bedroom.   What would you think of a man that said of his wife or girlfriend
    "I only love her in the bedroom"
    - isn't that what you are basically saying about the men in your life?
    •  Well, I disagree..... (0+ / 0-)

      .......sexual expression is one thing and emotional bonds are another. We like it when they coincide. If a man says "I only love my wife in the bedroom" he is denying the emotional bond that we expect in such a relationship. That would be ridiculous. But that emotional bond does not always tell us how he expresses himself sexually, and frankly, we don't even really want to know, do we?

      The only proof of that is in the bedroom and there as many different ways of expressing that as there are bedrooms.  We may assume from the fact that he is married that he expresses himself heterosexually in the bedroom. That is not always so, though. The only proof is what happens in the bedroom.  And even that is not the final proof. We don't ask "papers please" and so nothing prevents him from having sex with a man, other than the bonds of fidelity.

      It is much easier from a political standpoint if we require well-known people to present their papers if they are gay. If they take the podium and say "I used to love women, but I got my heart broken by a man, and now I think only another man can heal that, but there is this woman I used to love who is back in my life and now I am kinda tempted to get back with her and see how it goes...."  Well, that is just not politically effective. If he says "I am gay", that works politically, but doesn't describe things very well.

      But at some point we want to get beyond that where the expression of sexual conduct is not the first thing we think about a person anymore than their race would be. That conduct occurs in the bedroom (sometimes!).

      The rest of being "gay" is tribal and cultural. People engage in that conduct all the time outside of the tribe and so may not strongly identify with being "gay".

      This performer focuses not on the sexual conduct, but on the emotional connection he had with that man. I very much like the fact that he focuses on that aspect rather than presenting his papers.  It is touching and artistic and I am glad that we have reached that state in our evolution where we may no longer need to say "Papers, please".

      •  I have no clue what you are trying to say (0+ / 0-)

        in regards to my comments.

      •  I think you're taking this a bit too far. (0+ / 0-)
        The rest of being "gay" is tribal and cultural.
        Look, I self-identify gay and I don't like disco either.  It doesn't mean I stop self-identifying as gay, or disrespect the gays who like disco.   I'm still part of the tribe, and I welcome our diversity in expression.

        Identity's a complicated thing.  Some aspects of it are purely personal and/or biological, some are social and/or conditioned.  That's fine.  Labels can be restraining, no doubt.  But I do think you're overreaching in comments like this, where you try to cordon off gayness into a particular cultural paradigm.  

        Saint, n. A dead sinner revised and edited. - Ambrose Bierce

        by pico on Sat Jul 07, 2012 at 11:20:44 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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