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View Diary: Corporate America wants inexperienced teachers in the classroom (83 comments)

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  •  No the problem is that young people are not being (0+ / 0-)

    hired because veteran teachers (some well into their 60s) are trying to hold on to their salaries that were practical on yesterday's goverment budgets.

    Those young people left after 5 years because they weren't protected like the boomers and so they lost thier jobs.

    •  horsehit (10+ / 0-)

      veteran teachers are quitting in droves. they are just not being replaced. class rosters are out of control. I haven'tmet a teacher in their 60's in years. and I've been around for 25 years.

      •  Oh yeah? I know one that makes 100k (0+ / 0-)

        And she's fighting tooth and nail to keep it. 100k could pay for 4 young teachers. So who's full it?

         You've been around 25 years? I guess you don't like what I'm saying.  How many young teachers could be hired with your salary?  

        I think that most teachers that are in your position are more concerned about their own security than they are about the best solution for the current budget crisis.

        •  I stood up in front of our school board a few (10+ / 0-)

          years ago when they wanted to give our teachers no raise.  We live in a high property tax district in Ohio where the schools are a huge part of the life of the community and where we are willing to pay for not just good schools, but great schools.  We pay for art and band and orchestra and for teachers who have lots of experience.  We have the highest percentage of teachers with Ph.D.s teaching in our high school, out of the whole state.  Our kids graduate and go to college and we pay for a good system that will help them do that.  Key to that is putting caring people in front of them who have life experience and who are creative and reflective people.  And to get that kind of people, you have to reward them.  You have to not just attract them but keep them.  How do you keep them year after year if there's no prospect of a raise?  

          And I said to the school board, "what these teachers do with our kids every day is priceless.  We go to work every day and leave our kids in their hands.  We have certain values in this community with regard to our kids.  Certain expectations.  And we are paying our teachers good salaries because we trust that they will meet our expectations.  We can leave our kids with them every day because we know that there are good experienced people in the classroom forming our kids into great citizens while we are at work.  And that is something that we should be willing to pay good money for."

          What the hell are all these corporate types thinking?  They support CEOs making outrageous salaries even when they perform horribly, because the rationale is that they have to pay them this way in order to "keep talent."  But when it comes to schools, just try to get business types to apply the same logic.  

          That's one more thing to add to my long list of small problems. --my son, age 10

          by concernedamerican on Mon Jul 23, 2012 at 06:58:30 AM PDT

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        •  yeah,because older workers shouldn't be worried (7+ / 0-)

          about their own security, because no one would ever fire a seasoned teacher to save money,right? Look, the research is on my side, not yours. The diarist gave out some excellent references. Do your homework.

        •  100k could pay for 4 young teachers. (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Mindful Nature, bkamr

          Maybe that's why it's hard to keep teachers around.

          "A cynical, mercenary, demagogic press will produce in time a people as base as itself." - Joseph Pulitzer

          by CFAmick on Mon Jul 23, 2012 at 09:14:35 AM PDT

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        •  One. You know One. (0+ / 0-)

          Figures don't lie, but liars do figure-Mark Twain

          by OregonOak on Mon Jul 23, 2012 at 09:19:17 AM PDT

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      •  Look at the diarist's graph. I have no idea if it (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Only Needs a Beat

        is an accurate representation, but it shows a substantial increase in 25+ years experience vs 1988.  This is what one might expect from the boomer bulge.

        Perhaps an update to 2011 data will show the retirement wave accelerating.

        Where are we, now that we need us most?

        by Frank Knarf on Mon Jul 23, 2012 at 07:54:49 AM PDT

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    •  That is such a load of bs... (14+ / 0-)

      young teachers are leaving because right wing nut case governors are cutting education budgets so they can give more money to the rich oil/coal/whatever barons.

      Blaming older teachers is total BS and I am sick of so called left wing folks jumping on the right wing "blame the old, blame the teachers" wagon.

      I am a retired tired.   I started teaching in 1967.   Our salaries back then were cr*p.....extremely low for college educated workers. Factory (steel, auto) garbage workers all made a lot more.  Just about the only factory workers we made more than were the textile workers (and that's because they were mostly women, mostly non-union).

      In my teaching lifetime, I was on strike twice to insure teachers had the right to collectively bargain.   Our salaries were never that great.  Over 40 years, two master degrees (of which I paid for myself), my salary slowly grew.  Now I am told I am resented because I made so much money and have a retirement.  BS.  Back in the 80's it cost me over $5000 to get one MA degree.   And the reward for that was an increment of about $750.   I also HAD to take six credits to renew my license every five years (no increment for that plus I had to pay for the license and the credits).  

      I was involved in my union, paid attention to the issues and spent plenty of time supporting left/educating supporting candidates.  I mentored younger teachers, encouraged them to be involved, get more education, and stay committed.

      Please stop scapegoating veteran teachers for what right wing politicians are doing.

      •  I repeat, I know someone who makes 100k (0+ / 0-)

        She is is well into her 60s, and she sees teachers with teaching certificates doing substitute work on a daily basis, but she doesn't connect the dots.

        "The Left" that you speak of should be looking for a global solution to the current crisis in Education, not pandering to one interest group.

        •  Aren't you concerned with your own security? (10+ / 0-)

          My husband is an executive at a public company, no way he would take a pay cut so the next person down could get a promotion. Why should that teacher leave if she doesn't want to? Teachers are supposed to be pure altruists? Teachers pay property taxes too. (I shouldn't have to add this caveat, but I am NOT a teacher.)

          Oh, and you've made a good argument against raising the Social Security retirement age.

        •  I'd love to know where she teaches (8+ / 0-)

          because the average salary of teachers nationwide is 51K.  And by the way, because you know ONE person in their sixties who does this, you have decided to extrapolate that all "older" teachers do this?   Seriously?

          Is that what you do for everything? False generalize?   Because if you want to play that game, it's an easy one.  I could simply extrapolate all young white males are evil, desiring to mass murder innocents; all young black males are gang bangers; all young females are hookers using their bodies to make money, cause you know, I know someone who knows someone, who know......

          You do get how unfair that is, yes?

        •  So? She has decades of experience. (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          drmah, Ckntfld, samanthab, cpresley

          In any other profession that would be considered an asset to the community.

          Besides, if she's in a district that pays experienced teachers $100K, they sure as hell aren't hiring new teachers at $25K each, and they won't hire four. It's more likely they'll just increase the class sizes of those teachers who remain. That's usually the way it works.

          Most important, though: you're generalizing an entire profession based on your single example.

          Beware the man of one book.

          by fiddler crabby on Mon Jul 23, 2012 at 09:12:07 AM PDT

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        •  You know one? I know 95 who make less than (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          drmah, Ckntfld, Mindful Nature, cpresley

          35K a year after 10 years teaching. Your bias is showing....

          Figures don't lie, but liars do figure-Mark Twain

          by OregonOak on Mon Jul 23, 2012 at 09:20:58 AM PDT

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        •  so... (0+ / 0-)

          how old will you be when you decide it's time to "let the younger ones" divvy up your salary?  will you have children (and your loans for their college) and/or aging parents to support?  and doesn't the right wing want our retirement age to be higher, not lower?

        •  What would you suggest is a reasonable (0+ / 0-)

          salary for a masters +15 with 20 years teaching in the Bay Area or NYC or Boston?

          Where are we, now that we need us most?

          by Frank Knarf on Mon Jul 23, 2012 at 09:33:02 AM PDT

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        •  And she's probably worth far more than that (0+ / 0-)

          to society as a whole.  If you consider the number of students she has helped turn into productive members of society, we are still getting a good deal.

          She's closer to worth her wage than Mitt Romney is, that's for damn sure.

          Courtesy Kos. Trying to call on the better angels of our nature.

          by Mindful Nature on Mon Jul 23, 2012 at 09:47:40 AM PDT

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