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  •  6,860 American soldiers died fighting Al Qaeda (0+ / 0-)

    related wars. I don't think there were that many Al Qaeda members to start with. With the addition of 50,000 wounded Americans, I'd say Al Qaeda won the war big time.

    •  That's just silly (0+ / 0-)

      By far the bulk of U.S. casualties have come from fighting the Iraqi army of Hussein and Iraqi faction militias and the Taliban.  All three forces are either local to Iraq and its civil war factions or, in the case of the so-called Taliban, a force that is the major residue of the internal South Asian conflicts since 1947.

      I'll grant that the fighting with the Iraqi factional militias was nonproductive and a profoundly stupid Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld and neocon decision.  

      History will probably bear out that fighting the other two was ultimately productive.  We will not have a repeat of Hussein or the 2001 Taliban in their respective countries.

      •  Both wars had their roots (rightly or wrongly) (0+ / 0-)

        in the events of 9/11 which was a Bin Laden, Al Qaeda operation. Neither would have been able to occur w/o 9/11 as an excuse. Revenge for the Al Qaeda attack is central to both. Therefore, they are "Al Qaeda related wars".

        If America does not want a repeat of Hussein, the Taliban or 9/11 they must change their foreign policy. Both were arguably constructs and consequences of that policy. Sadly, I don't see any change on the horizon.

        Look at the state of the US right now. The mess it is in is a DIRECT result of the American government's response to Al Qaeda.

        Bin Laden won BIG TIME.....

        •  Sick Neo-Cons "pearl harbor" gave them excuses. (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Claudius Bombarnac

          No more.
          "What's so funny about peace, love and understanding"?

          •  I'm not so sure there will be a "no more" (0+ / 0-)

            Each generation tends to forget the lessons from the previous. Most people can be readily manipulated to believe almost anything by the MSM. We are watching it at this very time during the election season.

            "You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time..."

            and that is, unfortunately, all it takes.

            I figure there's a 50-50 chance of America going to war against Iran in the next several years. The People have already been primed and are ready to rumble.

            History has shown that once there is a will to war, facts can be 'massaged' to suit the requirements. No conspiracy required - just disparate groups/entities each acting in their own self-interest can provide the nexus for conflict.

          •  100,000's innocent people obliterated by American (0+ / 0-)

            bombs and you think it's funny? All that death and destruction (which is STILL FUCKING GOING ON) based on lies and deception. Assad at his worst cannot hold a Goddamn candle to American atrocities.

            It's hardly been a decade and you've already fucking forgotten! Typical...

            Here's Powell telling his lies to the United Nations attempting to get them to agree to go to war with the US based on "proven" Al Qaeda "connections" with Saddam.

            But what I want to bring to your attention today is the potentially much more sinister nexus between Iraq and the al Qaeda terrorist network, a nexus that combines classic terrorist organizations and modern methods of murder. Iraq today harbors a deadly terrorist network headed by Abu Musab Zarqawi, an associate and collaborator of Osama bin Laden and his al Qaeda lieutenants.
            But Baghdad has an agent in the most senior levels of the radical organization, Ansar al-Islam, that controls this corner of Iraq. In 2000 this agent offered al Qaeda safe haven in the region. After we swept al Qaeda from Afghanistan, some of its members accepted this safe haven. They remain their today.
             During this stay, nearly two dozen extremists converged on Baghdad and established a base of operations there. These al Qaeda affiliates, based in Baghdad, now coordinate the movement of people, money and supplies into and throughout Iraq for his network, and they've now been operating freely in the capital for more than eight months.

            Iraqi officials deny accusations of ties with al Qaeda. These denials are simply not credible. Last year an al Qaeda associate bragged that the situation in Iraq was, quote, "good," that Baghdad could be transited quickly.
            Last year, two suspected al Qaeda operatives were arrested crossing from Iraq into Saudi Arabia. They were linked to associates of the Baghdad cell, and one of them received training in Afghanistan on how to use cyanide. From his terrorist network in Iraq, Zarqawi can direct his network in the Middle East and beyond
             We are not surprised that Iraq is harboring Zarqawi and his subordinates. This understanding builds on decades long experience with respect to ties between Iraq and al Qaeda.

            Going back to the early and mid-1990s, when bin Laden was based in Sudan, an al Qaeda source tells us that Saddam and bin Laden reached an understanding that al Qaeda would no longer support activities against Baghdad. Early al Qaeda ties were forged by secret, high-level intelligence service contacts with al Qaeda, secret Iraqi intelligence high-level contacts with al Qaeda.
             This senior al Qaeda terrorist was responsible for one of al Qaeda's training camps in Afghanistan.

            His information comes firsthand from his personal involvement at senior levels of al Qaeda. He says bin Laden and his top deputy in Afghanistan, deceased al Qaeda leader Mohammed Atef, did not believe that al Qaeda labs in Afghanistan were capable enough to manufacture these chemical or biological agents. They needed to go somewhere else. They had to look outside of Afghanistan for help. Where did they go? Where did they look? They went to Iraq.

            The support that (inaudible) describes included Iraq offering chemical or biological weapons training for two al Qaeda associates beginning in December 2000. He says that a militant known as Abu Abdula Al-Iraqi (ph) had been sent to Iraq several times between 1997and 2000 for help in acquiring poisons and gases. Abdula Al-Iraqi (ph) characterized the relationship he forged with Iraqi officials as successful.

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