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View Diary: Obama campaign to Romney: Release just five years of returns (updated 2X) (315 comments)

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  •  elmo - who knows? (4+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    sethtriggs, justmy2, Wee Mama, Mickeyd

    Romney isn't capable of working on his own taxes. An article in the Boston Globe estimated that as many as 50 tax lawyers and CPAs work on the Romney return before it is filed. Even though he has both a JD and MBA Romney is not a tax expert by any means. All the big CPA firms will take aggressive positions, and PWC is right up there, but an undisclosed foreign account is not an aggressive position, it is illegal and the tax professionals could lose their licenses if they were a party to hiding foreign accounts. I just don't see it happening, but we are all speculating because none of us knows any definitive facts.

    "let's talk about that"

    by VClib on Fri Aug 17, 2012 at 07:05:35 AM PDT

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    •  Romney is a shambles in many areas but money (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      greengemini, 2thanks

      is not one of those areas.  Romney knows his money.

      Hey Ryan, where you goin' with that trans-vaginal probe in your hand

      by 88kathy on Fri Aug 17, 2012 at 08:13:52 AM PDT

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    •  I think you are very wrong. (7+ / 0-)

      Half of Romney's signature strategy is making money through tax dodges. He isn't in the business of actually producing anything, he skims from moving money and tax avoidances make up a large portion of that.

      It's not how much you make, but how much you keep.

      •  When in Rome - I dont' agree (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        sharman, nextstep

        The core business, and the current partnership tax law, allows investment partnership managers to take their incentive compensation as a capital gain. There are no tricks required, the tax law has been the same for 40 years. All the major investment managers raise money in parallel partnerships, one US based for US entities and tax payers, and one based in a tax haven for non-US investors. The managers end up with an ownership position in assets held in the tax haven, but those gains are subject to the same capital gains taxes as assets held in the US. The overwhelming majority of Romney's assets are held in the US and most of his foreign accounts came from the Bain Capital funds that were formed outside the US. The private equity business is actually very simple but few people here at DKOS actually understand how it works and most of our fellow bloggers have developed an uninformed understanding.

        The standard private equity model, and it represents most of what Bain Capital does, is to find a company with predictable cash flows, low debt and high taxes. They purchase the company from the existing owners, public or private, give the management a 10 - 20% ownership, leverage the equity capital they invest with debt at at 3-5 times the equity, grow the business and sell it or take it public for a higher value than they purchased it. What leverage can do is significantly increase the return on equity. If BC buys a company for $400 million, invests $100 million and borrows $300 million and the company value increases to $500 million BC has earned 100% on its equity investment even though the company's value only increased by 25%. That model does not need any fancy tax planning to generate long term capital gains for both the investors and investment managers. US tax payers owe the same amount of tax regardless of where the income producing assets are held anywhere in the world.

        "let's talk about that"

        by VClib on Fri Aug 17, 2012 at 10:16:22 AM PDT

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        •  I have yet to read a post of yours that (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          elwior

          I agree with.

          •  WheninRome - that's OK (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            nextstep

            I have very low approval needs and like to often provide readers with additional information that they don't receive from many of our fellow bloggers here at DKOS. That's what makes this site so good, we have lots of different areas of knowledge and points of view.

            I have never worked at a private equity fund but as the former manager of a Fortune 500 pension fund my company was a limited partner in several, so I probably have more background than most of the other people here. Nearly every Fortune 1000 pension fund, large public pension funds, and university and foundation pension funds are investors in private equity. It's nearly universal for large funds.

            "let's talk about that"

            by VClib on Fri Aug 17, 2012 at 11:36:59 AM PDT

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    •  Did the accountants who audited Enron's financial (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      elwior

      statements allow illegal things to happen.  Of all the professions, CPA's seem to be the most malleable when it comes to skirting around the edges of legality, and I would bet $10,000 that they would sign off on illegality if the probability that they would not get caught were large enough.

      And it feels like I'm livin'in the wasteland of the free ~ Iris DeMent, 1996

      by MrJersey on Fri Aug 17, 2012 at 11:13:50 AM PDT

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      •  MrJ - what happened to Arthur Anderson (Enron) (0+ / 0-)

        sent a shock wave through the now "Big Four". AA was put out of business, 50,000 employees lost their jobs and the partners lost hundreds of millions of capital. That was a serious wake up call.

        "let's talk about that"

        by VClib on Fri Aug 17, 2012 at 11:51:22 AM PDT

        [ Parent ]

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