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View Diary: No wonder Republicans don't want to talk about their platform (61 comments)

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  •  even worse (if you can believe it) is the life of (8+ / 0-)

    the pregnant woman. No one seems to be pointing this out, until this diary. Kaili doesn't assume, as so many others have, that Republicans would allow an abortion if the woman's life was in danger. If a fetus is made legally a human being and a U.S. citizen with all the rights and privileges thereof, there is nothing in anything the Republicans have said that deals with what happens if the pregnancy becomes a danger to the woman. Presumably it would be up to each state? Or would it be done on a case by case basis with a woman having to petition and go through the courts to get permission to have an abortion (by which time she might be dead).
    And if anyone thinks this is far-fetched, I refer them to the Catholic church's views on this re: excommunicating the nun who authorized an abortion performed to save the life of the mother:

    "She consented in the murder of an unborn child," says the Rev. John Ehrich, the medical ethics director for the Diocese of Phoenix. "There are some situations where the mother may in fact die along with her child. But — and this is the Catholic perspective — you can't do evil to bring about good. The end does not justify the means."
    And when it comes to the health of the woman -- what if a woman has cancer that will grow faster if she's pregnant -- not immediately life-threatening but it may mean the cancer will be beyond treatment by the time the pregnancy is over. What about an ectopic pregnancy? What about a woman carrying multiple (quadruplets, quintuplets, and beyond) embryos because of fertility treatment -- they would force a woman to carry multiple fetuses through a pregnancy even if there were serious negative consequences to her health. My bet is that under Republican rule (and no mistake, it would be rule), there would be no exceptions made for anything other than immediate danger to the life of the woman, and even then, they might refuse permission.

    We're not perfect, but they're nuts! -- Barney Frank

    by Tamar on Mon Aug 27, 2012 at 02:22:08 PM PDT

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    •  Here's the official word from a local (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Tamar, kyril, glitterscale

      Catholic hospital, Franciscan Medical Group, taken from their Policy and Procedure Manual:

      -    Operations, treatments, and medications that have as their direct purpose the cure of a proportionately serious pathological condition of a pregnant woman are permitted when they cannot be safely postponed until the unborn child is viable, even if they will result in the death of the unborn child.
      -    In case of extrauterine pregnancy, no intervention is morally licit which constitutes a direct abortion.
      For this hospital it looks as if chemo might be OK but an ectopic pregnancy would be a death sentence. I suspect the Republicans would use something like this as a model.

      I came for the politics and stayed for the science.

      by bwren on Mon Aug 27, 2012 at 02:46:01 PM PDT

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      •  so chemo is okay because it might damage the (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        bwren, kyril, glitterscale

        fetus but not kill it.
        Sounds like they would agree with excommunicating that poor nun/administrator of the hospital in Arizona because she authorized the abortion that saved the life of the woman (who already had 4 children).
        They would rather that a woman lose her life (knowing that would kill the fetus anyway) and 4 children lose their mother than have a live-saving abortion.
        Crazy. beyond crazy.

        We're not perfect, but they're nuts! -- Barney Frank

        by Tamar on Mon Aug 27, 2012 at 02:51:29 PM PDT

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    •  In the olden days knowledgeable women advised (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      kyril, Tamar, BachFan, glitterscale

      their pregnant kin and friends to select a Jewish physician, because he (rarely, she) would protect the life of the woman, whereas some Christian physicians would sacrifice the woman (even if she had young children depending on her) for the fetus if it came to an either/or situation.

      "'s difficult to imagine what else Republicans can do to drive women away in 2012, unless they decide to bring back witch-hanging. And I wouldn't put it past them." James Wolcott

      by Mayfly on Mon Aug 27, 2012 at 02:59:50 PM PDT

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    •  Ectopic pregnancy... (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Tamar, BachFan, Williston Barrett

      When Catholics and Evangelicals get together to run countries (e.g. Chile), they ban treatment even of ectopic pregnancies until the fallopian tube ruptures.

      "Let’s just move on, treat everybody with firmness, fairness, dignity, compassion and respect. Let’s be Marines." - Sgt. Maj Michael Barrett on DADT repeal

      by kyril on Mon Aug 27, 2012 at 03:11:34 PM PDT

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    •  Ectopic Pregnancies are not rare (6+ / 0-)

      In North America there are approximately 20 ectopic pregnancies out of every 1000 pregnancies which translates into over 100,000 ectopic pregnancies in the US each year. Thanks to early identification and surgical removal of the fetus, only 25-30 women die a year due to an ectopic pregnancy.

      Once upon a time, I would have assumed that an exception for this condition would have been part of any anti-abortion bill since the condition is not in the least ambiguous, the fetus has no chance to survive to viability and the mother's death is certain. Now, I assume nothing. Apparently the Republicans want to return us to the 19th Century were pregnancy was a dangerous time that could easily end a women's life.

      •  I have a friend who had several ectopic pregnanies (4+ / 0-)

        (and got necessary treatment). This was a woman who desperately wanted to have children, ended up adopting several and was finally able to carry a pregnancy to term.
        Republican policies would have killed her -- an extremely good person, doing good work and a wonderful mother to children originally from very difficult circumstances.
        We need more people like her, not fewer. She should be the kind of person held up as an example by religious leaders. Yet, if she were a Catholic, her church would condemn her for not dying.

        We're not perfect, but they're nuts! -- Barney Frank

        by Tamar on Mon Aug 27, 2012 at 03:58:22 PM PDT

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