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View Diary: A Message For House Republicans: "First Undo What You Did To Create This Debt Crisis..." (41 comments)

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  •  Perfect Analysis (16+ / 0-)

    And even better political talking points. Now, if only Democrats are willing to seize on this narrative and not run away from it.

    Oh, and Third-ways don't get their panties in a bunch and try and sabotage it.

    •  Indeed (5+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      elwior, smiley7, 207wickedgood, wbr, NonnyO
      Now, if only Democrats are willing to seize on this narrative and not run away from it.
      I'm sure that some will run away from it, but I can't begin to guess why they would...old habits, perhaps?
      •  There are poker players (not very good ones) who (8+ / 0-)

        will fold a winning hand because they get taken in by a bluffer.
          It seems to me though that the president (who is rumored to play some poker himself) has this hand figured out fairly well.
          He's seeing this one through to the end because he knows his cards beat theirs.
          So long as he does that, the GOP will either have to, at some point, show their hand, or simply figure out when to fold 'em.

           They would like to take the pot simply by telling what's in their hand, not showing it. They want for the People to simply "trust them."
            But the People won't buy it. Not this time.

            The only thing we got to watch for now is for them trying to turn over the table, accusing our side of cheating.
            You got to keep your eye on these "varmints!"

        "We the People of the United States...." -U.S. Constitution

        by elwior on Mon Dec 03, 2012 at 06:30:10 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  Bribes from corporations... (6+ / 0-)
        I'm sure that some will run away from it, but I can't begin to guess why they would...old habits, perhaps?
        $COTU$ made corporations people and in that disguise, corporations can use money as a form of "free speech."

        Ergo, corporate lobbyists have free access to our Congress Critters where We The People (who elected these monkey farts) don't even stand a chance of being acknowledged until election time rolls around..., and then we are flattered and cajoled into voting for them so they can go back to DC and get more $$$$$$$ from corporations when they "dial for dollars" - as Senator Sanders put it in a televised interview with Bill Moyers (Sanders is the only person worth his salt in the Senate).

        Why else would they vote to give the insurance, medical, and pharmaceutical corporations the power to fine us and/or have the force of law behind making us buy their crappy private insurance which goes toward paying executive bonuses and shareholders...., instead of buying into Medicare where the program is running efficiently, there is no overhead to worry about for profits or paying shareholders or bonuses...???  "All" that would have been necessary is to hire more employees and add office space to handle the extra paperwork to add everyone on to Medicare insurance; the economic impact of more jobs right here in America would have proved nearly instantaneous to the US Treasury with tax revenue, not to mention the buying power with those who had an income and could buy products (hopefully made in America).  From the president on down, very nearly all Congress Critters adamantly refused to discuss a not-for-profit single-payer option for medical insurance.  What a travesty!!!

        I'm sick of attempts to steer this nation from principles evolved in The Age of Reason to hallucinations derived from illiterate herdsmen. ~ Crashing Vor

        by NonnyO on Tue Dec 04, 2012 at 05:45:37 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  You make many... (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          NonnyO

          ...really good points, here.  Thank you for emphasizing them...

          •  In particular... (3+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            valkyrry, NonnyO, offgrid
            From the president on down, very nearly all Congress Critters adamantly refused to discuss a not-for-profit single-payer option for medical insurance.
            There is nothing that has bothered me more over the years than the failure of this country to follow Britain's example and embrace truly socialized medicine, taking the profit motive out of the health care industry entirely.

            Perhaps if a growing number of elected Democrats were able to conceptualize the superiority of a solidly progressive Democratic Economic Agenda over the embarrassing foolishness of Republican nostrums, they would be less likely to buy into all of that crap that Insurance Company lobbyists have been telling them at every opportunity.

            That is my hope, anyway...

            •  Thank you.... (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              James Kroeger

              That one particularly pissed me off, too!  I was so angry I couldn't speak about this stuff for months without flying into a rant.  I still can barely restrain my rants to something coherent.  Our Congress Critters and the President were nucking futz idiots for voting for the corporate plans!!!

              I want to adopt the health insurance/care versions adopted by the three Scandinavian countries.  Paid parental leave, in particular, which is over a year long for BOTH parents to bond with their child(ren).  Jobs waiting for them when they go back to work (from parental leave or paid sick leave).  No one goes bankrupt from catastrophic illnesses.  If someone has to stay home to take care of a sick relative, the leave is paid.  In all cases, their jobs are waiting for them when they can return to work.  Childcare for working parents is provided.

              Sweden: Land of the Stay-At-Home Dad
              Note: In the video, the fathers are "expected" to take their parental leave!  If they don't, it's a mark of shame.  How much better are the hands-on skills of fathers who bond with their kids early?

              Gloria Riviera embarrassed all women by being stupid enough to ask a father what baby items she was holding.  Sheesh.  Since she hadn't had her baby at that point, I'm quite sure the father knew a heckuva lot more than she did about it all.

              Another old video:
              Sweden's Health Care System [w/Lou Dobbs]

              I'm a senior citizen.  The monthly cost of Medicare that started when I was in the working world continues when on Social Security because it's deducted before Soc Sec is deposited in my account (just as it is for all senior citizens or those who are disabled and receiving Soc Sec)..., but at least I don't have to be concerned about paying for corporate insurance executive bonuses or shareholders for the Medicare deduction.  Medicare is actually working efficiently, believe it or not.  That's why I advocate everyone buying into Medicare and caps put on the medical costs that doctors can charge..., and I further advocate no additional charges..., mandated by law.  The hospitals and clinics used to "justify" their increases to 'new machinery' - but those new high tech machines must be paid for ten or twenty times over by now.

              The US is a backward country compared to the civilized countries in the world who have excellent - and "free" - medical care and educational systems.  [Not free, high taxes, but everyone benefits and no one has to fork over money, by law, to pay for corporate executive bonuses and shareholder profits, the other part that grates on my last shredded nerve.]  Heck, we're even behind some third world countries in other surveys!  How humiliating!

              The three Scandinavian countries also have free education from kindergarten through high school and/or college, and they start their kids learning English as a second language in grade school through whatever highest grade of school they complete.  If they attend college away from their home, they get a living stipend so they can devote their time to their studies.  [No tuition debt upon leaving college.  Education, like medical care, is considered a right.  Everyone pays into the system; everyone from king to commoner, benefits.]

              Corporations who sell medical supplies are not allowed to gouge the system for additional money, and what they can charge is set by the government (fair, but not extravagant).  If they do any price gouging to patients, they're in violation of the law and they are prosecuted. [What a novel idea: prosecuting a corporation to the fullest extent of the law....]

              Not surprisingly, all three Scandinavian countries made the top five in list of best places to live again:
              Best Places to Be Born in 2013 | Healthy Living
              The top ten best places to be born in 2013:
              1. Switzerland
              2. Australia
              3. Norway
              4. Sweden
              5. Denmark
              6. Singapore
              7. New Zealand
              8. Netherlands
              9. Canada
              10. Hong Kong
              [US & Germany tied for 16th place.]

              I'm sick of attempts to steer this nation from principles evolved in The Age of Reason to hallucinations derived from illiterate herdsmen. ~ Crashing Vor

              by NonnyO on Tue Dec 04, 2012 at 02:05:21 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

        •  mmm... (0+ / 0-)

          I am in favor of a tax increase (back to 1990 levels) for the purposes of reducing debt.  However, this post is full of the kind of arguments that I cannot take seriously.  The very first graph shows a gap of about 300 billion dollars per year from 2002-2008.  This was caused by a combination of the recession, the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan AND tax cuts.  Even if the entire gap could be attributed to tax cuts and the Iraq war only, 300bn per year times 6 years (2002-2008) adds up to 1.8 billion with is a figure completely disconnected from the 5.9 trillion number.  At the very least, the graphs and the numbers should add up.   It’s all well and good to point out that the 5.9 trillion came from only one estimate, but why even use that figure if it is totally disconnected from the graph below.  In other words, I can troll around the internet and find all kinds of facts, figures and graphs from places like the CATO institute website, which, if I string them all together the right way, makes it appear that the Democrats caused the Great Recession.  However, that doesn’t mean it is close to being true.  

          For another example, look at the Employment-population ratio graph.  The Clinton Tax increase occurred right as we were recovering from a recession.  The Bush tax cuts occurred right after we entered a recession.  Does anyone expect stimulus in the form a higher spending or tax increases to have an instantaneous affect?   Of course the Bush tax cuts occurred on a downward trend on that graph.  If the trend hadn’t been going down, the cuts never would have occurred in the first place.  You don’t enact stimulus (either in the form of spending increase or tax cut) when the economy is doing well.        

          There are sites you can go to really dig into the numbers and figure out what is going on.  However, most of the time, I am forced to read from a variety of sites and news sources, and, even more importantly, read the dissenting comments attached to those articles to figure out what is really going on.  This is especially true for sites like volokh.com or autobloggreen.com where the best information is contained in the comments.    Bring on the disapproval clicks.      

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