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View Diary: The unions killed Hostess…another right wing myth. (56 comments)

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  •  the teamsters are now right wingers? (0+ / 0-)

    www.teamster.org/content/teamsters-bakery-workers-should-hold-secret-ballot-vote-hostess

    •  Where did I say anything about the Teamsters? n/t (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Glen The Plumber

      "Republicans only care about the rich" - My late Father (-8.25, -7.85)

      by Mark E Andersen on Fri Nov 16, 2012 at 04:51:06 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  The Teamsters... (0+ / 0-)

        ...approved virtually the same contract the the bakers rejected.  Oops...
        ....also, it might be relevant to include the fact that the CEO you reference many times as the target of your ire has not been at the company for some time....
        Oops...

        •  Ahhh...the anti-union trolls are out n/t (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          mungley, Glen The Plumber

          "Republicans only care about the rich" - My late Father (-8.25, -7.85)

          by Mark E Andersen on Fri Nov 16, 2012 at 05:07:36 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Ahhhhh....an intelligent response... (0+ / 0-)
            •  Really? That is all you have? (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Glen The Plumber, nomandates

              You will blame the unions no matter what. Did the Teamsters accept a deal, yes, did the fact that UCFW did not kill Hostess? No...you cannot expect the workers who actually built the company to take pay cut after pay cut while the profits are sucked out of the company and CEOs take 300% raises.

              By your logic we should all be working for minimum wage and just be happy we have jobs. Which is exactly what corporate America wants. A bunch of sheep who will do whatever it takes to stay employed. Feel free to bash unions...I am willing to bet you will be the first one to wonder where they are when they are gone and worker protections go away.

              "Republicans only care about the rich" - My late Father (-8.25, -7.85)

              by Mark E Andersen on Sat Nov 17, 2012 at 05:56:48 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

        •  The baker's union took a 30% cut (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Liberal Mole

          a couple of years ago.

          They also had their pension - into which they each paid $3/hr out of their own pockets -  stolen by management (the funds were "borrowed," after which management went to court to get the "borrowed" funds declared un-payable).

          At the same time, it was entirely clear that management would shutter the company NO MATTER WHAT the union agreed to, since there was no way that tiny concession could have any impact whatsoever on the company's ability to meet its debt payments - $1.2 Billion in debt is an impossibly heavy burden in an industry with margins as slim as the snack food industry.

          So the union told them to stuff it.

          Why was the company seeking this concession when it planned to shut down anyway?  Because management and the investors have preferred shares. The payroll counts as a liability when the company is liquidated, and would cut the value of those shares when the assets are sold.

          Preferred shareholders get paid first from the proceeds of the liquidation - before any other debtor is paid. They wanted to do everything in their power to take every last possible penny for themselves - by robbing the employees of another 30% of their pay.

          Well, the employees refused to be robbed. Good for them.

          •  You are just wrong... (0+ / 0-)
            Preferred shareholders get paid first from the proceeds of the liquidation - before any other debtor is paid.
            In a bankruptcy the order of payment is:
            DIP provider
            Secured Creditors
            Unsecured Creditors
            Shareholders

            There is no way...full stop...that the preferred shareholders get paid before creditors.

            As an aside, it was hugely controversial when in the auto bailout the unsecured pension obligations were put ahead of the secured creditors.

            But ahead of the equity...never.

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