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View Diary: Victims Do Not Survive (23 comments)

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  •  What does this mean ? (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Farugia, misslegalbeagle
    ...and the blind supporters who salivate like Pavlov's dogs when the dinner bell about Israel rings for thier treat

    "Drop the name-calling." Meteor Blades 2/4/11

    by indycam on Sun Nov 18, 2012 at 06:18:44 PM PST

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    •  I think it means... (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      mahakali overdrive

      ...that, like most other commenters on  here, the diarist has a particular perspective, which she is setting aside in favor of the universal.  

      If this comes to an end before there are too many more victims, it will be because people who have far, far more pronounced perspectives than the diarist's manage to sit down and talk.

      We should do so well.

      ...j'ai découvert que tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos dans une chambre.

      by jessical on Sun Nov 18, 2012 at 06:56:42 PM PST

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      •  Your interpretation is generous . (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        misslegalbeagle

        Who are the "blind supporters" ?
        Why do they "salivate like Pavlov's dogs" ?

        "Drop the name-calling." Meteor Blades 2/4/11

        by indycam on Sun Nov 18, 2012 at 07:07:37 PM PST

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        •  For me (6+ / 0-)

          The diary was defined by the letter, as mediation on war.  

          It isn't anything that you can't hear all over the world.  You can even hear it in the comment threads of diaries next door to this one.  I really liked the letter and the sharing of it, it carried the cold complicated jolt of history in it.  

          I also want to say that over six years on DK, a lot of people have stood up for me and been nice to me and put up with the bumps in my essays and perspectives.   And yes, this is the wild wild west and only the mindful and rhetorically aware survive and all that.  But the sense I've gotten from this diary and the few others I've read by this diarist is that there is some real care and effort here, and it doesn't feel like polemic.  I get that there are some views that are very different than my own.  I also get that part of what we do here is learn how to have alliances with people whose stories and perspectives are very different from my own.  

          Mileage varies.

          ...j'ai découvert que tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos dans une chambre.

          by jessical on Sun Nov 18, 2012 at 07:24:23 PM PST

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          •  You didn't answer my question , you danced . (0+ / 0-)

            If you have to dance , maybe you should have another look .

            "Drop the name-calling." Meteor Blades 2/4/11

            by indycam on Sun Nov 18, 2012 at 07:28:46 PM PST

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            •  Well (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Mentatmark, gramofsam1

              There's a logic to me in seeing images of civilians in war, thinking immediately of the ways one's family has experienced war, and sharing that.  That held up for me, no dancing required.  

              I think the bias you cite could be fairly addressed.   In the place it occurred and per the words used.  And heck, it's DK, maybe it's all polemic and you're all really squirrels and I will never know.  But I took it at face value, good and bad.

              ...j'ai découvert que tout le malheur des hommes vient d'une seule chose, qui est de ne savoir pas demeurer en repos dans une chambre.

              by jessical on Sun Nov 18, 2012 at 07:54:12 PM PST

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              •  Once agin ... (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                misslegalbeagle
                ...and the blind supporters who salivate like Pavlov's dogs when the dinner bell about Israel rings for thier treat

                Who are the blind supporters ?
                What are they salivating about ?
                What is the dinner bell ?
                What is the treat ?

                Don't BS the answers ,
                answer the questions 1 , 2 , 3 , 4

                "Drop the name-calling." Meteor Blades 2/4/11

                by indycam on Sun Nov 18, 2012 at 08:02:36 PM PST

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    •  Notice the context (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      native, jessical, Tonedevil

      I come from a place, and can see and read media that shows the horrors that both sides commit in the 'escalation' (is what shooting is called in this conflict) between the two sides.  We see the Palistinian side (recently the Israelis targeted the media center in Gaza City to try and prevent it...but we are still getting the Gazan side)   Neither side is excused in my opinion from the violence toward the other.

      I have witnessed war personally by being simply born in a country where it happened, and people like me were at one time deemed 'ideological sympathisers' in the war against 'Communism' that began much earlier, had more players, and was much broader in territory than what Americans know as the 'Vietnam war'.  

      Alot of the things that were done in the name of fighting Communism,  even after the occupation of the Japanese are just now coming to light.

      So, the experiece of my grandmother was in Malaysia.  Her strength taught me not to hate, to forgive but never forget in the context to speak for those who are oppressed and to deal with life as it comes to me.

      "...I tryed to think of how I would write without taking a side, or be harsher to one side than the other, knowing that where I come from, and what I read shows the horrors of war committed on both sides, and the puppets, the proxies, the enablers, and the blind supporters who salivate like Pavlov's dogs when the dinner bell about Israel rings for thier treat...but, as you can see, I cant any more..."
      For clearity, I have high lighted the part you quoted.  

      Please note that even in the part you quoted, you noted that it was ABOUT Israel (the topic) and not against, or for, and was ment to be taken as 'people jumping to take a side on the conflict.  However, notice I didnt say which side they took...which was the point of my diary...not to take a side, but to relate an experience to shake us from the focus on the guns, and bring us to those who experience the uglyness of what the guns do...to people, to families, to attitudes, and to the future of the conflict itself.

      One of the commenters said correctly that my diary is not about Jews, or comparing Jews to someone else.  In fact, it is not about Jews at all, and mentioning Israel (a poltical entity) has nothing to do with Jews, except some Jews, along with Christians, Muslims, Athiests, and others live within the political boundries of the 'State".

      Oaths and alleginaces only become valid after being tested in adverstity.

      by Nur Alia Chang on Mon Nov 19, 2012 at 06:08:44 AM PST

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