Skip to main content

View Diary: For a lasting peace, lift the Gazan Blockade (31 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  And, for the 193rd time, is the blockade barring (4+ / 0-)

    medicine, food, construction supplies, water purification systems and the like, which is what it does in practice, and, oh yes, shooting fishermen working on Gaza's coastline, keeping missiles out? Judging from the number fired in the last week, that particular missile blockade is a complete failure.

     The problem with your argument is that although the alleged purpose of the blockade is to keep missiles out, it is plainly not doing that but is strangling the civilian economy and endangering the health of all Gazan residents. The plan to get by abuse the cooperation of Gazans in ejecting whoever Israel does not like this week (remember, Jabari whose death triggered this round was the Israeli subcontractor for control over and dealings with factions of the opposition who did not belong to or heed Hamas and had been so for some time, until he became, apparently nolonger useful enough to Israel) is plainly not working either and there is no indication that more abuse will change the result.

    •  That's why I'd support a test period. (0+ / 0-)

      If you're right that it's not having an impact on the ability of Gazans to put together more rockets, then strikes shouldn't materially increase.

    •  Priorities (0+ / 0-)

      It's hard to escape the idea that if numerous huge missiles can be smuggled into Gaza, it would be possible to smuggle in sufficient quantities of non-military supplies to sustain life and rebuild what has been destroyed.  Hamas controls what passes through the tunnels, and they have made their choices.

      The blockade doesn't keep the missiles out, but the missiles don't achieve any result except to bring down countervailing force.  The people of Gaza would be better off with more food, medicine and construction supplies instead.

      •  How would you like to live in a state where (0+ / 0-)

        everything but a list of 118 or so items, as it was with Israel's list a year ago, had to be smuggled in. That was the case, and although there have been claims of loosening from this very short list, one of the loosenings was two trucks of date bars sent to WB. Before then cinnamon was allowed in by the Israelis but cumin was not, no construction materials as they could be used to build military facilities, the water purification, electrical generation and other plants offered by Europe to Gaza not permitted in although Israel itself sells water and electricity to  Gaza, and the like. This blockade and how it works is not a secret. And smuggling has its own social and other costs, and should not be necessary for food, medical supplies and the like, but is because all but the 118 as sort of expanded are stopped at the border by Israel, which also works to make the Rafah border run under the same rules. It should not be that way, but Israel as a government makes sure it is.

        •  You are missing the point (0+ / 0-)

          Of course trying to live under these conditions sucks. But what does one do under the circumstances? Hamas has the ability to control what is smuggled in and its choices are to incite Israeli attack by bringing in offensive weapons instead of bringing in as much food, medicine and construction materials as possible. It may be emotionally satisfying but it confirms the image of Hamas as terrorists, alienating potential support in the international community, and it fails to address the most immediate needs of the suffering residents of Gaza.

          •  If you NEED to believe that Hamas controls all and (0+ / 0-)

            acts only as terrorists, you may see it that way, but the sunglasses you use are yours, not that of the facts on the ground.

            The reporting has made clear that as to matters missile, Hamas tries for control over other factions, but does not yet have it, and the factions who are apparently doing most of the shooting are doing so in no small part in opposition to Hamas as being not militant enough.  Today's NYT reporting also makes clear that a high percentage of what was shot from Gaza was aimed at empty ground, the symbolism and power but without the same kind of intentional firing on places were civilians are that Israel planned and executed. But you need for your own reasons to have Hamas control all, so you claim it does. You need them to be terrorists so you can ignore the actual effects of what Israeli government is doing.

            And to defend the blockade, you have to show something, which I invite you to try, that is to show why the best remedy for Israel's missile issues, if those really were their issues at all, is limiting food, medical supplies, water purification adn electrical generators, constructions materials, etc etc etc. The cinnamon and cumin issue is on you to justify, as is the flat out governmental statement that they calculated exactly how many calories of food per Gazan got in so they would be hungry but not starving exactly. How is that the best remedy, least harmful to civilians.

            Today's reporting in NYT raises other questions about the purpose of the Israeli assasination and attack in any event, pointing out that they were using it to tune up for a subsequent run at Iran, seeing if Iron Dome worked well, not particularly at all as a response to what happened BEFORE Israel attacked and assasinated Jabari. And the FM is in the paper stating flat out that one of the things they will have to do is flat out invade to change the government in Gaza no matter what the people of Gaza think, just as he has advocated the same for WB, becauset the leaders do not serve the purposes of Israel.

            •  Still missing the point (0+ / 0-)

              I am addressing what is smuggled through the tunnels into Gaza, not what is fired out of Gaza. Are the tunnels being used as much as possible to relieve the suffering of the people of Gaza (and, yes, of course, it should not be necessary but that is the reality).

              When 20-foot-long missiles are brought through the tunnels in pieces and reassembled in Gaza, Hamas knows about it and condones it. I have not seen any suggestion that Hamas does not have substantial control over what comes through the tunnels.  And my point is that Hamas can set priorities over what the tunnels are used for, and evidently missile components are using time, space and energy that could be used for all the life sustaining and life improving items you mention.

              Thank you for reiterating all the things that are wrong with the blockade and all the criticisms that can be made about Israel's policies and motives.  I did not address them, and your ad hominem approach to addressing me is inappropriate. I chose to question Hamas policy in an area that is clearly under their control - the use of the tunnels - under the circumstances that actually exist.  The rightness or wrongness or those circumstances is a separate topic amply discussed here.  The fact is that as the leadership of Gaza, Hamas has a responsibility to the people suffering there, and it has not chosen to maximize the amount of food, medicine, etc. that it is within its control to deliver to them.

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

  • Recommended (128)
  • Community (64)
  • Elections (24)
  • Media (23)
  • Environment (23)
  • Civil Rights (22)
  • Culture (22)
  • Science (21)
  • Trans-Pacific Partnership (21)
  • Law (21)
  • Josh Duggar (20)
  • Labor (18)
  • Economy (17)
  • Ireland (16)
  • Marriage Equality (16)
  • Bernie Sanders (16)
  • Hillary Clinton (15)
  • 2016 (15)
  • Climate Change (15)
  • Rescued (15)
  • Click here for the mobile view of the site