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  •  The Dem's have now gone to the Senate Commissary (3.00)
    for a big cold bowl of Vichysoise.

    My grandma told me: if it's got testicles or tires, at some point it's gonna give ya trouble

    by wilfred on Mon May 23, 2005 at 05:46:13 PM PDT

    •  Hey buddy! (4.00)
      That's "Freedom Soup", please!

      George W. Bush -- It's mourning in America.

      by LarryInNYC on Mon May 23, 2005 at 05:51:51 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

    •  FUCK! (3.92)
      CAN PEOPLE STOP USING FUCKING ANALOGIES FROM THE NAZI ERA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      NOBODY IS GOING TO AUSCHWITZ WITH HARRY REID PUSHING THEM INTO A CATTLE CAR!!!!!!!!!

      Criticize it all you want, but please, it's fucking insulting to people who suffered under fascism every time a deal is made that people don't like to say that Democrats are fucking Nazi collaborators using a term for a group that abetted in genocide.

      Dammit, if you know that little history, read a fucking book to come up with another analogy!!!!!

      •  Fascists, yes, Nazis, no (none)
        Nazis were indeed fascist, but not all fascists are Nazis.  

        Thank you for your reality check.

      •  I'll stop using Nazi analogies (none)
        when the Repugs stop acting like Nazis.

        Crawford Uber Alles!

        Shopping Macht Frei!

        Ein Volk! Eine Partei! Eine Kirche! Ein Fuehrer!

        Heil Bush!

        America: It's a good IDEA for a country ...

        by Tony Seybert on Mon May 23, 2005 at 05:59:10 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  oh,yes (none)
        you're absolutely right ...

        we shouldn't compare appeasement to thugs placing three judges who don't believe in minority rights, or the commerce clause to anything that bad. We should come up with NEW descriptions for spineless appeasement, a cowardly unwillingness to stand up for any of the traditions of this country. No, they aren't as bad as Nazis.

        How about we compare them to Benedict Arnold, only they're not going to get caught. Maybe we should ask how many of pieces of silver they got, and who's (and which) cheek they kissed? Perhaps we should compare them to the reservation police who stabbed Crazy Horse in the back, or how about the the business partner who helps a criminal gang clean out the accounts.

        Pick your analogy for these hacks we're supposed to support.

        "Whenever a Voice of Moderation addresses liberals, its sole purpose is to stomp out any real sign of life." - James Wolcott

        by Madman in the marketplace on Mon May 23, 2005 at 05:59:36 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  put your exclamation points down and come out (none)
        with your hands up.

        Please DH, go easy on the hissy fit. It's called an analogy and since when does it have to be 99.9% pure to be acceptable to use? Almost never. If you don't like the analogy then move on dude because it ain't going away anytime soon.

        My grandma told me: if it's got testicles or tires, at some point it's gonna give ya trouble

        by wilfred on Mon May 23, 2005 at 06:00:19 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

        •  00.1% Accurate, If Even That (none)
          C'mon, are you really going to stick with it, you're really going to say Democrats are like the Vichy?  

          Some of us consider ourselves Democrats.  Wave your flag of purity if you want, but I'm not a fucking fascist sympathizer, and when you call "Democrats" Vichy, you're insulting me and the majority people at Daily Kos.

          Plus, intellectually it's fucking vacuous.

          •  amen (none)
            enough with the Nazi stuff already.  It's so fucking lazy.
            •  But it's fun! (none)
              Ein Volk! Eine Partei! Eine Kirche! Ein Fuehrer!

              (Nazi Germany is not my field, but I have read so much on the period, Shirer, Toland, Speer, Trevor-Roper, Bullock, and Ian Kershaw's recent two-volume biography of Hitler. I see it happening in my own country, bit by bit, step by step. When is it okay to start voicing these feelings? When the infinite war starts? (Got that!) When dissent is characterized as treason? (Got that!) When the media is controlled to only give out the government's approved statements? (Got that!) Internment camps with no due process? (Got that!) Nationalistic justification of torture? (Got that!) I'd rather not wait until it's illegal to call it fascism to start calling it fascism.)

              America: It's a good IDEA for a country ...

              by Tony Seybert on Mon May 23, 2005 at 06:43:38 PM PDT

              [ Parent ]

              •  Well... (none)
                • Infinite war? (It's been two years.  We'll see)
                • Dissent characterized as treason? (In some predictable quarters.  Bill Maher losing his tv show does not prove your point)
                • Media controlled to only give out the government's approved statements (Hardly)
                • Internment camps (Got that)
                • Nationalistic justification of torture (Got that)

                I think you're overstating your case, but in any event, call it fascism all you like.  I just get sick of the "Nazi!  Nazi!  Nazi!  School of liberal polemicizing).

                   

                •  Better to overstate my case now (none)
                  than to keep silent and pray for the best.

                  Besides, how can you say the War On Terror is not an infinite war? And, by the way, they started bombing Afghanistan (maybe you've heard of it) in October 2001, almost four years ago.

                  And how many people have to shout treason or say you're helping the terrorists for this to count in your book? We're talking about more than a few nutjobs. We're talking about the Attorney General (Ashcroft) and the frickin' vice president. And even the president himself said that you couldn't be a patriot if you weren't religious. I used to be on the staff of a campus newspaper and I got a lot of hate mail and I know a lot about how bad this problem is.

                  On the subject of media control, I'm wondering if you've ever heard of Jeff Gannon, Armstrong Williams, Fox News, right-wing talk radio, and MSM kowtowing on things like the Killian memo, the "fake" Newsweek story, and repeating the story that the Dems coined the phrase "nuclear option."

                  How much worse does it have to get?

                  America: It's a good IDEA for a country ...

                  by Tony Seybert on Mon May 23, 2005 at 07:27:39 PM PDT

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Ya Heard? (none)
                    I can say the WOT is not an infinite war because "infinite war" is just a phrase you're employing to summon up parallels to the book "1984" and has no real meaning.  
                    Afghanistan - I have heard of it, thanks - I was talking about Iraq, but okay 3 1/2 years versus 2.  Still not an "infinite war," whatever that means.

                    How many people crying "treason" will it take for me  to start accepting every half-baked Third Reich parallel that comes down the pike?  Dunno.  Fashionable though it's recently been to play the "treason" card, I don't feel the animus of the current political atmosphere approaching McCarthyism's heyday, let alone Germany, 1937.

                    And, yes, I've heard of the list of right-wing media crap.  Have you heard of the NY Times, LA Times, Washington Post, etc.?  I ask, because if the implication is that there's no counterbalance to JimJeff in the MSM, you've seriously gone around the bend.

                    Btw, the Attorney General is Alberto Gonzalez.  Ever heard of him?  

                    •  Who's around the bend? (none)
                      The LA Times, the NY Times, and the WaPo are the "counterbalance" to JimJeff.

                      Uh, yeah.

                      Would you like some Kool-Aid with your tripe? (Or is that tripe with your Kool-Aid?)

                      Ein Volk! Eine Partei! Eine Kirche! Ein Fuehrer!

                      Heil Bush!

                      America: It's a good IDEA for a country ...

                      by Tony Seybert on Mon May 23, 2005 at 08:39:49 PM PDT

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  They're (none)
                        more than a "counterbalance," they're the fucking national press.  And fuck you very much for implying I'm some kind of wingnut.  Who do you think you are, asshole?  Oh, I forgot - you worked at a college newspaper.  You must know what you're talking about.
                        You know, condescending doctrinaire pricks like you are exactly what's wrong with this site.
                        Instead of addressing anything of substance, let's just whip up the biggest paranoid froth we can muster whilst blogging in our dorm rooms by the light of the lava lamp.
                        I guess I'm either with you or against you right?
                        Piss off.
                        •  You're totally right! (none)
                          Just because the Republicans haven't engineered the Reichstag fire, invaded Poland, annexed Austria, re-militarized the Rhineland, made a pact with the Soviet Union, imprisoned dissidents and Jews, slain the Brown shirts, formed an alliance with Imperial Japan, they are nothing like the Nazis.

                          Thank you for your kind, constructive comments.

                          America: It's a good IDEA for a country ...

                          by Tony Seybert on Tue May 24, 2005 at 10:21:25 AM PDT

                          [ Parent ]

          •  oy vey (4.00)
            i might be pissing off the majority? funny, it didn't bother me when the majority of this country thought Saddam had something to do with 9/11 and i disagreed. It didn't bother me when the majority of the country thought we should go to war in Iraq and i disagreed. I can deal being in the minority in the US and (so far anyway) just this once at DKos.

            And to say that there isn't neo-fascism in this country in the Neocon protocol is vacuous so watch the darts you're throwing. We now torture and defy the Geneva convention and have modern day concentration camps like Guantanamo and Abu Ghraib while throwing people with the flimsiest of cause into corporate Learjets and whisk them away to Uzbekistan where they are subjected to untold horrors with our governaments full participation and approval. And to compromise with the party in power that is carrying out these horrendous actions is worth many labels and one of them is collaborator, especially while they are gutting the checks and balances of our country.

            My grandma told me: if it's got testicles or tires, at some point it's gonna give ya trouble

            by wilfred on Mon May 23, 2005 at 06:36:00 PM PDT

            [ Parent ]

      •  How's this? (none)
        My first thought was it was like Nebuchadnezzar at Pelusium, when he was called home at the death of his father. It looked like it was all over for Pharoah Necho, of course, but with the bad news it was more profitable for Nebuchadnezzar to pull back and establish his power at home. He would be stronger to fight another day.

        The lesson of Pelusium (at that point) for Democrats might be you can take your lumps today or you take them tomorrow. But the good thing about postponing the immediate crisis is you never know what might happen in the interval to change your fortunes.

        Nebuchadnezzar didn't come back right away, and I don't see the Republicans bringing this up again soon.

      •  Er, am I missing something? (none)
        Whats the Nazi connection to that post? Too subtle for me...

        In the midst of life we are in debt, etc.

        by ablington on Mon May 23, 2005 at 06:04:06 PM PDT

        [ Parent ]

      •  Does this mean that we shouldn't say (none)
        That now we have "peace in our time"?

        To be fair, this comprimise could work out OK, but only if we make this part of the campaign issue of "irresponsible, power-mad Republicans"/"party of James Dobson and Tom Delay" in the '06 elections.  I'm not holding my breath.

    •  eating at a seat at the little people's table (none)

      "Whenever a Voice of Moderation addresses liberals, its sole purpose is to stomp out any real sign of life." - James Wolcott

      by Madman in the marketplace on Mon May 23, 2005 at 05:53:38 PM PDT

      [ Parent ]

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