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View Diary: Turns out Romney's internal polls needed the unskewing (172 comments)

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  •  They will discount the root causes... (12+ / 0-)

    ...of the problem, no matter how much the FPers put it in their faces.

    It's more than demography. A critical mass of those they believed all along were "their voters" stopped automatically assuming that "what was good for Wall Street must be good for the Country."

    They may still be wary of "Big Government" but it is less scary to them now than it has been for many, many election cycles.

    When you are right you cannot be too radical; when you are wrong, you cannot be too conservative. --Martin Luther King Jr.

    by Egalitare on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 06:49:49 AM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  The problem wasn't really their internal polling- (19+ / 0-)

      it was that they thought they had the election "fixed" in all the crucial corners--voter suppression in FL and PA, voting machines controlled in OH. They counted on those fixes working.

      The rest of it--polls, predictions, attention paid to states they didn't need in order to win--were window dressing, or distraction.  

      I wouldn't be surprised to learn that they weren't really seriously polling at all. Just pretending they were.

      The GOP actually bought this election, and still lost. The inner circle must be sick over it.

      •  Not to mention the possibility that Wikileaks (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Sweet Endolphins Heal

        wasn't just blowing smoke when they claimed they'd disabled the vote fraud part of the Republican's Orca program. They said they would announce the particulars in a few months. Let's see if they back up their talk with proof.

        "Mit der Dummheit kämpfen Götter selbst vergebens," -Friedrich Schiller "Against Stupidity, the Gods themselves contend in Vain"

        by pengiep on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 09:38:41 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Yes, we're not allowed to discuss that here (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          sharman

          so "sshhhhh"

          Although I did take note that the very first time I read an online account from an ORCA insider (linker right here from DailyKos to much acclaim, btw) it mentioned that ORCA was hinder by a DOS attack.

          But then when a plausible explanation for how that came to be was put forward, for some reason that crossed into conspiracy theory territory and we weren't allowed to talk about it. . ..  

          •  I don't think you understand (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            dfe

            There's no ban on talking about ORCA---a GOTV app---whether it worked or failed or was DDoSed by hackers.

            The ban is on conspiracy theories about Evil Karl Rove rigging voting machines, or rigging the election.  ORCA had nothing to do with voting machines, or vote counting, or vote reporting or anything.

            Those diaries crossed into CT territory because for some reason, people decided that ORCA was an evil vote-hacking app, although nobody could provide a coherent explanation for how that could make any sense.  And of course there was no evidence, either.  It's sort of like the Right's obsession with ACORN.

            Also:

            Although I did take note that the very first time I read an online account from an ORCA insider (linker right here from DailyKos to much acclaim, btw) it mentioned that ORCA was hinder by a DOS attack.
            The anonymous letter didn't say they launched a DoS attack.  It was instead a weirdly computer-illiterate description of putting a "firewall" on the "tunnels" or some such.

            Taking jokes seriously is the exact mirror activity of laughing if someone says they have cancer. --jbou

            by Caj on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 12:02:05 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  No, what I'm talking about is the ban (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Sweet Endolphins Heal

              on talking about Anonymous' (alleged) role in bringing down  Romney's GOTV effort (aka ORCA).

              That is crystal clear.

              What is less clear whether Anonymous can or cannot be discussed anymore at this site in any context, because no matter what action it (allegedly) takes, there is no proof.

              But in many contexts that doesn't seem to matter.  For some reason the Powers That Be at this site seem uniquely freaked out about the election fraud issue.    

              For the record, I've have no idea why.  

              •  No, that's not what was banned. (0+ / 0-)

                Those discussions about ORCA had titles like,   "Anonymous claims it stopped Karl Rove from hacking the vote."   Clearly these people weren't just having a discussion about GOTV efforts, they were promoting a vote-hacking conspiracy theory, in which "ORCA" was in some inexplicable way a vote-hacking program.  That's why these people were banned.  

                What is less clear whether Anonymous can or cannot be discussed anymore at this site in any context, because no matter what action it (allegedly) takes, there is no proof.
                Then let me clear that up for you.  There is no ban on things you can't prove.  Lots of everyday events have no proof.  There's no proof that I dreamed about a giant talking cookie last night.  But of course we can talk about that without being banned.

                The ban is on conspiracy theories---extraordinary claims, damning accusations, presented without a shred of evidence.  These things require evidence, especially since many of them are logistically absurd or do not make much sense upon examination.  

                Taking jokes seriously is the exact mirror activity of laughing if someone says they have cancer. --jbou

                by Caj on Fri Nov 30, 2012 at 02:11:02 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

            •  I should add, that when ORCA went down (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              glassbeadgame

              the ORCA insider attributed that to a DOS attack.

              But clearly they had their heads so far up their asses they couldn't tell a DOS attack from any other mechanism that might have been fucking with the system, e.g., what Anonymous was claiming to have done.  In any event, I don't see why Anonymous would be heavily invest is describing accurately exactly how they impacted ORCA, if indeed they were involved at all.

              •  I agree (0+ / 0-)

                Incompetence explains the ORCA failure way better than a deliberate attempt by anyone to hose it.  Any self described insider has an axe to grind by fabricating an excuse for why it was such an epic fail.

                There was no need to attack ORCA -- it was doomed to failure by a number of software development mistakes: Inadequate testing, terrible documentation, inadequate training, no plan B.

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