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View Diary: CNN Losing Bradley Manning Story: Manning Was Reporting a War Crime, "The Van Thing" (286 comments)

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  •  I agree that the whole MIC, wars, and (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Garrett, databob

    war mongering companies, the mess needs more sunshine, and that whistleblowers need avenues and intermediaries to interrupt corruption, but their needs to be some kind of editorial judgment in between the raw evidence and disclosure.

    That there is some important benefits to the US and to the world to expose war crimes, yes, that is clear.

    But you and I can not possibly know who paid the cost for the gross volume, indescriminating data dump.

    I don't see how any government can function without confidential diplomatic meetings and reports.  The fact that many of the diplomatic cables were not top secret, and were merely confidential, doesn't mitigate the fact that the documents were STOLEN by someone under a duty to safeguard them.

    The break down in military discipline was evident long before Bradley's alleged theft/whistle/data dump.

    •  As a user of the information, (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      LilithGardener, aliasalias

      I very specifically like the "indiscriminate" and "gross volume" aspects of some of the Wikileaks data dumps.

      Quite formally: someone else's editorial judgment, prefiltering the raw data, wrecks the data's usefulness for inductively drawing conclusions.

      •  I agree that any kind of raw data has value (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Garrett, wenchacha

        for it's own sake, without any imposed biases or filters, a fresh pair of eyes can sift, filter, identify patterns that others did not see, or could not see.

        It's an immense challenge, how to deal with the break down in the rule of law, the wide-spread breakdown in military discipline, the likely number of war crimes, and graft, and so on. When so many actors each seeking to establish their own spy network, with intelligence that can be held against others, I suspect we will be sorting out the modern "J Edgar Hoover" age for many decades to come.

        Question for you: How do you know the raw data is authentic? How do you know some was not held back? How do you know false information wasn't intentionally planted?

        Understand where I'm coming from?  A whistleblower platform that has no knowledge of the source, can not possible be a secure source of knowledge.  It would be too easy for one organization to feed prejudicial information into it about it's competitor.

        How do you deal with the possibility of fake data?

      •  Even if BM did hand off 200,000 documents (2+ / 0-)
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        Garrett, databob

        and even if he claims that yes, he did, and even if some intermediate says, yes, I received X gigabytes from BM, and gave them to Wikileaks, there is authentication in that chain.

        Bradley can't point to each page, and say for certain, yes, that's one of the pages I stole and gave to my contact.  

        I'm not invoking CT, I'm just suggesting that except for a few indelible memories, he can't certify which files are exact copies. Only someone with access to the original source or personal knowledge of the events recorded can certify that copies weren't edited.

      •  One aspect that makes me very sad, is that (2+ / 0-)
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        Garrett, wenchacha

        I believe most people serving in the military are honorable people who, most of the time, attempt to do the right thing, in shitty circumstances.

        BM should never have been sent to combat. I watched the video of the interview with his father and I felt really sorry for BM, although he's not entirely blameless either. It seemed evident from about age 7 his father was not around much. His mother was isolated and completely dependent.  I think his father didn't know how to have a father-son relationship.

        BM is very bright, and if he had remained stateside, with a company commander who looked out for him, gave him enough structure, but also guided him to channel his creativity and drive in a useful direction, he might have matured into a decent soldier, doing some kind of geeky office work.

      •  The conditions of his detention are a disgrace - (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        I feel ashamed, again, about what some in our military are willing to do to their fellow man.

        At the same time, it was also mildly disturbing to read accounts of his testimony, where he answered in such a way that the people present laughed.  Laughter? It made it sound like he was well prepared to tell his story, and "entertain" them.  He has every right to present himself as a sympathetic and likable person. But that seemed off to me. And could mean many different things, an intelligent person under enormous stress, coping with a surreal experience, or it could mean the story of his life is now bigger than he had ever dared to dream and he's working it for full effect, with sarcasm, etc. as if it's a game.

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