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  •  you must be a comedy writer, what you are (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    a2nite, burlydee

    offering up is white racism post civil rights era 1.0.

    what you are offering could be featured in a a sociology 101 textbook.

    great stuff!

    •  Don't accuse me of something (0+ / 0-)

      if you're not adult enough to go out on the limb to try to argue the point. Not seeing racism hiding under every surface is not racist. It's just a rejection of race based politics no matter where it lies.

      There are plenty of real examples of racism in society. A brooding brown skinned ninja in a zombie landscape full ludicrous half baked characters isn't one of them.

      Call me a racist? Get your ass in here and defend it. You don't get to call me that and get off easy. That's a serious accusation. Get your ass in here and you either back what you said up or you back up period.

      •  bad mouth! do you kiss your mom with that?> (0+ / 0-)

        "Not seeing racism hiding under every surface is not racist. It's just a rejection of race based politics no matter where it lies."

        That is a classic colorblind racism appeal. It minimizes the obvious that white supremacy and racism still structure outcomes and life chances in this society on a day to day basis and also structurally. How does it do this? By putting the responsibility on poc to "prove" to the satisfaction of Whites that racism is "real." Hell of a trap, no? Proving to someone that a system they are invested in is real to their satisfaction?

        "Race based politics" is also another nice rhetorical move in terms of post civil rights era racism. It falsely makes equivalent the justice claims of people of color regarding racism, with white people's denials of racism and/or silly claims or "reverse racism" and "white victimhood."

        I can engage in any number and/or types of conversations on this matter. But, I call out racist foolishness, such as what you offered, when necessary.

        •  You don't talk about my mother either. (0+ / 0-)
          That is a classic colorblind racism appeal.
          Being colorblind is the goal, not racist. You're reading racism into a shlocky television show. Nevermind kids being shot in the street. It's the same thing as accusing Tinkie Winkie of being gay and Sesame of being socialist. You haven't proven your point again. You're just using the same circular reasoning fallacy.
          It minimizes the obvious that white supremacy and racism still structure outcomes and life chances in this society on a day to day basis and also structurally.
          First of all, let me let you in on white culture. It is not homogeneous. The Anglos don't view themselves the same as Slavs and the Brits don't view themselves the same as Irish. There is no supremacy. Merely the illusion of such. But since you're the kind of guy that likes to lump everyone of one skin color into one group, you don't comprehend that. There's merely "us" and "them".
          By putting the responsibility on poc to "prove" to the satisfaction of Whites that racism is "real." Hell of a trap, no? Proving to someone that a system they are invested in is real to their satisfaction?
          Translation: I don't have to prove anything! Elmo is an anti-Semite because I said so! You have to prove everything in life. That is just scientific. If you want me to take things on faith, you're in the wrong place. I'm not  a preacher. Go testify your magical visions elsewhere. I deal in facts, not fraudulent accusations. And as I already stated there are plenty of real racisms in society, I'm not exactly ignoring it. Trayvon > Micchone.
          It falsely makes equivalent the justice claims of people of color regarding racism, with white people's denials of racism and/or silly claims or "reverse racism" and "white victimhood.
          All racism is equivalent. All bigotry is equivalent. Your misery doesn't trump anyone's on the basis of skin. My family was enslaved during World War II. Swaths of my family were killed during World War II. In an attempted genocide. But yeah. You totally have monopoly on getting screwed. It's totally more meaningful when you get discriminated against and that's totally not a racist bigoted notion in itself. golf clap
          I can engage in any number and/or types of conversations on this matter. But, I call out racist foolishness, such as what you offered, when necessary.
          You called out nothing. You have not proven your point at all. You are still calling me racist just because. And have now outed yourself as a bigoted by portraying the struggles of your people as somehow fundamentally more important than other equal harms perpetrated on others. They aren't. Pain is pain. And your hostility and insistence that your situation permeates even something as banal and thoughtless as a zombie show is just a sort of self-imposed exile and cop out from being held to the same standard as others.

          You know you've made it when you've started emulating white victimhood. I have the great benefit of being a European Indigenous Person. A term you didn't even know existed till just now. But which nonetheless makes me incredibly distinct from whatever culture is cultivated by White Anglo Saxon Protestants, both in reality and in your mind. Whoops. Too bad for you.

          •  now you are really proving my point (0+ / 0-)

            "First of all, let me let you in on white culture. It is not homogeneous. The Anglos don't view themselves the same as Slavs and the Brits don't view themselves the same as Irish. There is no supremacy."

            I think you need to get a good history book about race, ethnicity, identity, and the nation state. Read the invention of the white race vols one and two or Painter's more recent a History of White People.

            Being colorblind is the goal, not racist.

            Colorblindness is not the goal. An appreciation for human difference in all of its forms, and as part of our full personhood is the goal. Noticing racial differences is not the problem; it is the value that is placed on such judgments that is the problem. Conservative colorblindness is integral to post civil rights era racism. The racial identity of people of color is not a problem to be overlooked or ignored, a la the white privilege classic phrase, "you are my fried, I don't see your color."

            All racism is equivalent.

            More fictions. Racism is a relatively new invention. Racism is about color and or other social markers, i.e. what happens to Jews and others during WW2 as marginalized, exploited, and made subject to exclusion by Power and the Racial State.

            In this society at this time racism is the social ill of white people. Only white people can be racist in this society because they have the most institutional, social, political, economic, and cultural power. Race is a fiction; it is also real. Other people can be bigoted and prejudiced. White people have the unique ability to be racist. Remember prejudice plus power equals racism.

            "I have the great benefit of being a European Indigenous Person. A term you didn't even know existed till just now. But which nonetheless makes me incredibly distinct from whatever culture is cultivated by White Anglo Saxon Protestants, both in reality and in your mind. Whoops. Too bad for you.'

            What the heck are you talking about? Come to America with your white indigenous identity--whatever that is--and see how you are treated. You would seen, understood, treated as, and perceived to be a "white person." With that comes all of its privileges. I don't get this marginalization myth you are coming up with. Please explain.

            •  If your point is that you are wrong, then I am. (0+ / 0-)
              I think you need to get a good history book about race, ethnicity, identity, and the nation state. Read the invention of the white race vols one and two or Painter's more recent a History of White People.
              Translation: You can't make a good point yourself so you tell me to read a book.  Go read the dictionary. Don't reply till you're done.
              Colorblindness is not the goal. An appreciation for human difference in all of its forms, and as part of our full personhood is the goal. Noticing racial differences is not the problem; it is the value that is placed on such judgments that is the problem.
              You are wrong. Equality, colorblindness. That's the goal.  Now you're saying noticing racial differences is not a problem, but you only want to do so on your own malignant terms. You just outed yourself as a complete racist with all the racist justifications.
              More fictions. Racism is a relatively new invention. Racism is about color and or other social markers, i.e. what happens to Jews and others during WW2 as marginalized, exploited, and made subject to exclusion by Power and the Racial State.
              BWAHAHAHAHA at racism being a new invention. The Curse of Ham/Canaan is basically the ancient Judeo-Christian explanation of black skin. And it's not as if they people who preceded written history were less tribal or awful about this kind of stuff. We just only have proof as far back as writing goes. But yeah. Pretty new stuff.
              In this society at this time racism is the social ill of white people. Only white people can be racist in this society because they have the most institutional, social, political, economic, and cultural power. Race is a fiction; it is also real. Other people can be bigoted and prejudiced. White people have the unique ability to be racist. Remember prejudice plus power equals racism.
              I can't believe you just handed me the argument like that. I mean, I truly hoped you'd say something that flat out racist and dumb but I never thought you would. Kudos. I have officially outed you.
              ? Come to America with your white indigenous identity--whatever that is--and see how you are treated. You would seen, understood, treated as, and perceived to be a "white person."
              I am in America. Not everyone is as banal as you are. Not everyone is a racist as you are. Honestly as soon as you said "only white people can be racist" that's it right there. End of conversation. You officially lost everyone  you might have had sympathizing with you right there.
              •  can you even define what racism is? (0+ / 0-)

                I think not.

                If you understood what racism was, you would know that it is a recent invention of the 16th or perhaps even 15th century. Sure, people hated, killed, were bigoted, and prejudiced. We are not that kind as human being. But racism as the social-scientific-philosophical-moral-economic system that it is, is a very very recent a product of modernity.

                You need to do some basic work before you can engage in a mature conversation on this topic. I gave you some reading suggestions because I am not going to do the work for you. Clearly, you have some basic misunderstanding about history. Another suggestion would be the great, short, and very accessible book Racism: A History.

                "Equality, colorblindness. That's the goal. "

                This is just priceless. I do not even think you read what I wrote. You are very reactionary and knee jerk in your defense of conservative colorblindness. Why is that? What is your investment in such childish and flat thinking about the real nature of racism and white supremacy in the West? Am I hitting too close to home?

                You still haven't explained what the heck a European Indigenous Person is? What is this fiction that you have created? Is that some new term among the white race realist white people are oppressed crowd?

                •  I'm the mature one here and you're just flailing. (0+ / 0-)

                  The curse of Ham, as previously mentioned and ignored like everything else I say that you have no good answer to, is used as the justification for the subjugation of the Canaanites. That they were cursed with blackness and live to be servants thusly. You are not the arbiter of what get to be included as racism. Not that it makes any real difference but you are, in fact, wrong on this point. You seem to be making an effort to be entirely wrong on every point. Kudos for being very thorough.

                  I gave you some reading suggestions because I am not going to do the work for you.
                  You're losing even more people with that attempt. LOL. "I could totally destroy your argument. I just don't want to! READ A BOOK!" You are sounding more and more right wing tea party all the time.
                  What is your investment in such childish and flat thinking about the real nature of racism and white supremacy in the West? Am I hitting too close to home?
                  It's not childish to have the goal of total equality. What's childish and flat is to unintentionally ironically state that racism is in itself a trait of only one race. If you were hitting close to home on white supremacy, I'd be living a life of luxury. You're just being nonsensical at this point. It just kills you that you:

                  a) Know nothing of my culture, which is actually entirely separable from the American WASP machine you're really raging agianst.

                  b) You're being put in your place on matters of race because you see racism in a bowl of Spaghettios. Your skin color has nothing to do with your ability to be a malignant and completely racist person. You prove that.

                  You still haven't explained what the heck a European Indigenous Person is? What is this fiction that you have created? Is that some new term among the white race realist white people are oppressed crowd?
                  Read a book. Oh wait, read wikipedia for a primer:

                  http://en.wikipedia.org/...

                  I'm enjoying the fact that you are so foamy at the mouth over something that has been established very clearly. You revel in your ignorance and it's just another aspect of your racism. You're all too happy to be entirely insulting about a matter of someone's heritage when it isn't your own.

                  I'm sitting here laughing at you. Others are sitting here laughing at you. Of all the legitimate issues you could have hitched your boat to, you chose none of them. You picked a zombie show on AMC. And you've been making a fool of yourself ever since.

                  •  i think you are 12 or maybe 13 (0+ / 0-)

                    you have not "destroyed anything." you are content to remain ignorant and proudly proclaim that you are not willing to do any work.

                    the very same book i mentioned to you would explain the roots of modern racism in anti-semitism. again, you don't want to read so you would not know that.

                    please don't bring up silly Wikipedia as a definitive source on this or other matters. when you write your papers in college or high school please do not cite it either. spare your instructors a laugh.

                    a fool? by truth telling. nah. answer some basic questions without the name calling. i like chatting with you; it is good sport, fun, and doesn't take much effort.

                    do share some more about this ethnic identity you discovered for yourself on wikipedia and how it has any social meaning in terms of power, resources, or the like in the United States.

                    •  You're losing. Best not to say it's to a 12 yr old (0+ / 0-)

                      lol

                      you have not "destroyed anything." you are content to remain ignorant and proudly proclaim that you are not willing to do any work.
                      You can live in your own dream world. The vast majority of comments here are telling you not to see racism in your morning toast.
                      the very same book i mentioned to you would explain the roots of modern racism in anti-semitism. again, you don't want to read so you would not know that.
                      If you can't distill that book, that's your problem. Telling someone to read books isn't a valid debate tactic. Whatever little you have distilled, I have debunked.
                      please don't bring up silly Wikipedia as a definitive source on this or other matters. when you write your papers in college or high school please do not cite it either. spare your instructors a laugh.
                      This isn't a paper and considering you didn't have any clue that such things existed, you don't get to taunt Wikipedia. What a desperate angle.
                      a fool? by truth telling. nah. answer some basic questions without the name calling. i like chatting with you; it is good sport, fun, and doesn't take much effort.
                      Your opinion isn't truth. You're a fool if you can't make the distinction. You've been reduced to just bravado, babble, and right wing ideology.
                      do share some more about this ethnic identity you discovered for yourself on wikipedia and how it has any social meaning in terms of power, resources, or the like in the United States.
                      Again mocking  my identity. You know why I let you get away with it? I know you personality type. I've seen your personality type before. You're the timid non-confrontational guy who tries to act big online. You can either show respect or you can have me continue to erode your own credibility.

                      You didn't even know my indigenous people existed. Now that you do you belittle it, write it off, and claim it gives me world domination powers. You are everything that you claim to revile. You are not a progressive. And I'm far from the only one here that has noted how nutty your ideology is.

            •  Read Benjamin Isaac (0+ / 0-)
              Racism is a relatively new invention. Racism is about color and or other social markers.
              That may be a modern interpretation, but racism goes back to the ancient Greeks.
              •  antiquity was about in group and out group (0+ / 0-)

                status, they had an understanding of the differences in skin tone. the european ancients and others could certainly be accused of ethnocentrism of a sort. but racism? no. that terms has been dumbed down and bastardized in our common speech. racism, as i noted above, is a modern invention. track down some of the cites i gave there if you are curious.

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