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View Diary: Bob Costas & truly innovative gun violence solutions (52 comments)

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  •  They have the keep and bear part (0+ / 0-)

    but don't seem to have the well-regulated part down yet.

    Hey, GOP - Get In, Sit Down, Shut up, & Hang On!

    by 88kathy on Wed Dec 05, 2012 at 10:24:47 AM PST

    •  Because it is not a limiting condition... (3+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      oldpunk, rockhound, 88kathy

      either grammatically, historically or through case law.

      •  So why say well-regulated? What does that mean? (0+ / 0-)

        Hey, GOP - Get In, Sit Down, Shut up, & Hang On!

        by 88kathy on Thu Dec 06, 2012 at 10:34:52 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Link: (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          88kathy, PavePusher

          Republicans cause more damage than guns ever will. Share Our Wealth

          by KVoimakas on Thu Dec 06, 2012 at 11:06:01 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Thanks. I guess I want to hear that like (0+ / 0-)

            free speech not being free to yell fire in a crowded theater, going ape shit on gun ownership, any gun, any one, any time isn't guaranteed by the 2nd.

            But it seems we can't discuss it w/o labels. I think it will swing back and forth between interpretations for a long time.

            Are guns necessary for security of a free state?   I mean if you don't necessarily have to be in a militia or even contribute to the security of freedom.  Then couldn't the next interpretation be that guns aren't necessary.

            Hey, GOP - Get In, Sit Down, Shut up, & Hang On!

            by 88kathy on Thu Dec 06, 2012 at 02:48:49 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  "any gun, any one, any time"..... (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              88kathy

              seems to be a claim made mostly by people who are against guns.  I can't think of any "pro-gun" person who really believes anything like that.

              "Security of a free state" arguably begins with security of the individual.  If you take away a defensive option, you lessen security of the individual and, by extrapolation, the free state.

              By the way, you can yell anything you want in a theater.  But you'll be held accountable for the results, if you cause physical or financial damage to anyone.  They don't sew your mouth shut at the entryway.

            •  Yelling fire (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Opieo, 88kathy

              I love TechDirt. Here's a link to an article they have:
              link

              The thing is, you CAN yell fire in a theater. There isn't a limit on that. There's a problem if there isn't a fire and you do it to harm others.

              So, the regulation is on HARM. I think we already have laws against that.

              Guns aren't necessary. Neither is free speech. Neither is religion. Neither is free press. Neither is...and so on.

              Republicans cause more damage than guns ever will. Share Our Wealth

              by KVoimakas on Fri Dec 07, 2012 at 07:11:03 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  But lets say you lose you gun, are you still (0+ / 0-)

                responsible for anything harm that gun does?  Gun responsibility is not very sticky and easily passed on to others.  There is harm, it is from your gun, but you can say it (getting back to the fire in the theater) wasn't my hands that pushed the child under the mob running for the door, it wasn't my feet that trampled that child.

                See what I am saying, gun responsibility is not sticky.  You get out of it with the slightest excuse.  Someone took it, I lost it, I forgot I had it, it wasn't me.  

                That would be like blaming your shout of fire on those that got hurt because they had ears and could hear your shout.

                Hey, GOP - Get In, Sit Down, Shut up, & Hang On!

                by 88kathy on Fri Dec 07, 2012 at 10:55:06 AM PST

                [ Parent ]

                •  ...how do you LOSE a firearm? (0+ / 0-)

                  My shit's locked up or on my person. I have no idea how I'd lose a firearm. I think a person should be held responsible for their shit, yes.

                  Someone STOLE it from my house? No responsibility on my part since a criminal act took it from me.

                  I dropped it on the ground and left it there? Yeah, responsible.

                  Left it out for a kid to play with? Responsible.

                  I forgot I had it? First, if you're wearing a firearm and you don't use it, what harm is going to come to others from your having your firearms? Secondly, how the F do you forget you have your firearm?

                  It wasn't me? Well, it's truly not you then yeah, it's not your responsibility.

                  Republicans cause more damage than guns ever will. Share Our Wealth

                  by KVoimakas on Fri Dec 07, 2012 at 11:03:15 AM PST

                  [ Parent ]

                  •  Not sticky. That's like saying, yeah I yelled (0+ / 0-)

                    fire but everyone should have known there wasn't a fire.  Not my fault.

                    There is always a way out of gun responsibility.  

                    For every act of gun violence, there have been many hands that touched the gun that are not responsible.  I think too many hands are not responsible.  You don't.  You think their lack of responsibility is reasonable.  

                    I think gun responsibility should be more sticky.

                    Hey, GOP - Get In, Sit Down, Shut up, & Hang On!

                    by 88kathy on Fri Dec 07, 2012 at 11:28:04 AM PST

                    [ Parent ]

                    •  I think that certain people aren't responsible (0+ / 0-)

                      and certain are. I've even given examples.

                      Republicans cause more damage than guns ever will. Share Our Wealth

                      by KVoimakas on Fri Dec 07, 2012 at 11:51:02 AM PST

                      [ Parent ]

                      •  I think responsibility should be stickier. (0+ / 0-)

                        You say you couldn't protect your home if it was stickier.  I say my security is threatened because gun responsibility isn't stickier.  

                        You say no way.  

                        Hey, GOP - Get In, Sit Down, Shut up, & Hang On!

                        by 88kathy on Fri Dec 07, 2012 at 11:59:11 AM PST

                        [ Parent ]

                        •  Actually, no, that's not what I said at all. (0+ / 0-)

                          I have you examples when I think people should be held responsible and when they shouldn't. Would you like to respond in kind or respond to my examples?

                          Republicans cause more damage than guns ever will. Share Our Wealth

                          by KVoimakas on Fri Dec 07, 2012 at 12:17:41 PM PST

                          [ Parent ]

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