Skip to main content

View Diary: Charter schools don't perform as advertised, but try getting their advocates to admit that (152 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  why? (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    ipaman, angelajean

    why can't different methods of teaching compete for the public money?  why not let them take some of the kids who would otherwise go to a different school?

    some people like the choice of different methods of instruction.  I feel that direct instruction failed me so I wanted something like Montessori for my child.  he's doing great in that environment.  I'm not sure if that would be the case in direct instruction method of teaching.  

    I understand that some charter school companies are scams and deserve to be called Bain.  but really?  for Montessori schools?

    Stop Prohibition, Start Harm Reduction

    by gnostradamus on Sun Dec 16, 2012 at 07:03:12 PM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  fairness (10+ / 0-)

      The basic problem is one of fairness. Public schools are held up to unrealistic standards, and when they don't reach those standards, their money is taken away and handed off to private schools (including charters) that aren't judged by the same standards.
      As Laura's article shows, they refuse to be judged by the same standards. But if those standards shouldn't apply, then why use them to assess the publics?

      More importantly, my tax dollars shouldn't go to support a program that every kid in the district can't use. If the charters (and privates) accept every student who applies, and they agree not use public funds for the support of a religion, then they should be eligible to compete for those public funds.

      Those rules don't apply to your kid's Montessori school, or my kid's Waldorf school, or the Jewish School that I attended as a child. I know that those schools shouldn't siphon money away from the very necessary public schools around here. I pay my taxes happily (well, maybe not happily) knowing that I am supporting the public good.

      •  public montessori have to test (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        A Citizen

        my kid's school takes the same state tests as other public schools, and they do great every year.  granted it's an affluent area and I understand and sympathize with the the other arguments about unfairness of poor kids not being able to drive their kids to school etc....

        but IF and it's a big unrealistic IF I know... but IF money wasn't an issue one day, would you be against alternate methods of teaching being available to parents?

        Stop Prohibition, Start Harm Reduction

        by gnostradamus on Sun Dec 16, 2012 at 07:28:25 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  of course not (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          RainyDay, bear83, chuckvw, murphthesurf

          That's why my son is in a Waldorf school.

          But it IS all about the money right now: money that is NOT going to public education; money that IS going to private corporations; money that is NOT going to teachers (in both charter and public schools); and so on.

          If infinite public money were available to support education, I would be happy to have parents choose to use it in any viable (non-religious) educational institution.

      •  It's a labor issue (13+ / 0-)

        There are two reasons that the charter movement is bankrolled largely by venture capital and private equity: 1.) Powerful interests want to crush teacher's unions and all unions, and 2.) Powerful interests see a tremendous revenue stream in privatizing public education. There's no reason you can't have different types of schools within a public school system -- my son's progressive public elementary school in NYC is a great example. The argument for charter schools is, in the end, this: Public schools are failing us because of teacher's unions, and if we could only liberate them from the unions and use market incentives to motivate teachers, our children would blossom. The reality is that where public schools are failing us (and you'll notice they're doing just fine in affluent suburbs all over), they're failing us because they're inadequately resourced to address the complex problems of poverty that their students carry to school with them. Either we need to address poverty in a systematic way or we need to give schools in non-rich districts much greater resources to help students (and their whole families) who need not just a little extra attention but things like housing, better nutrition, greater stability at home, etc.

        "Those who would give up essential liberty, to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." -Benjamin Franklin

        by Septic Tank on Sun Dec 16, 2012 at 08:59:26 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Very important points (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          Besides squashing teachers' unions, it also squashes teachers' salaries.  Wage compression within the teaching profession will result/is resulting.  In the long run, this will cause even more gifted teachers to leave the profession.  

          The real motivator here is corporate profit.  It's about big business getting easier access to our tax dollars.  

          And I absolutely agree that poverty is at the heart of the matter, as well as economic segregation.  Failing schools will continue to fail if we don't address issues outside the classroom as well as inside the classroom.  

        •  Exactly! (0+ / 0-)

          Wish I could rec your post a thousand times.

    •  Montessori School option in Public Schools (6+ / 0-)

      There are public schools that offer Montessori as an option at least for kindergarten but they are few and far between.  I don't understand why the public schools have such an antipathy to Montessori.   We've found that it far surpasses the quality of most public school methods, especially when kids are placed in Montessori classrooms from 2 on.  Those kids fly and not just in terms of academics.

      Another topic altogether - Until the public schools also address the needs of very well prepared and very  high ability students, charter schools will have an audience. As it is,  many public schools are becoming schools for learning delayed and learning disabled students.  Parents of children with other needs find their children don't have advocates or adequate programs in public schools; especially in urban areas.  

      Newt 2012. Sociopath, adulterer, hypocrite, Republican.

      by tikkun on Sun Dec 16, 2012 at 07:35:09 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  We have a public Montessori school in Minneapolis. (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:

        It's Kindergarten through 8th grade. It was our second choice, but we got our first choice of public schools.

        The wolfpack eats venison. The lone wolf eats mice.

        by A Citizen on Sun Dec 16, 2012 at 08:31:40 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  The challenge for Montessori is that it is in (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        mtnlvr1946, tikkun

        direct opposition to a system where children are obligated to learn a rigid set of content and take a rigid set of tests based upon their year in school.

        Only gifted kids are going to do well when the curriculum doesn't line up with the test. And if they don't do well, the school goes into Program Improvement and The Man will come down and insist that the kids are taught the test-aligned curriculum... to the minute.

        So you can see the reluctance to take all the time to build a program that you'll likely have to tear down in 4 years.

        Fry, don't be a hero! It's not covered by our health plan!

        by elfling on Sun Dec 16, 2012 at 09:26:42 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

      •  The LD children were mainstreamed (0+ / 0-)

        Back in the 90's, to supposedly "normalize" them.

        It was right after that the right wingers started screaming about test scores, ignoring the fact that there were far more LD children in the public schools then.

        Women create the entire labor force. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Sympathy is the strongest instinct in human nature. - Charles Darwin

        by splashy on Sun Dec 16, 2012 at 10:59:44 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

    •  I personally have no problem with that as long (0+ / 0-)

      as we all recognize that the school populations are different, and don't use the charter school as a cudgel to beat the neighborhood school upside the head.

      I think it can be a good thing to have a range of educational experiences within a district or area - so long as no individual child has less because of it.

      Fry, don't be a hero! It's not covered by our health plan!

      by elfling on Sun Dec 16, 2012 at 09:22:41 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site