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View Diary: Never Cry Wolf - A Pack of Lies (188 comments)

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  •  You're not alone in lacking understanding (2+ / 0-)

    of wildlife management, other than googling I always recomend  Aldo Leopolds Game Management as it is the broad basis for all Wildlife Management in the US and many other countries.

    Wildlife has been carefully managed using science for three quarters of a century, biologists have gotten good at it. Believe me if they wanted hunters not to shoot collared wolves they would have said so. Hunters are used to shooting, or not shooting, collared big game animals depending on what the various departments of wildlife want them to do. Hunters also shoot only male mountain lions when told to do so, or male elk with five or more points per side, or male spike elk only, or cow elk only, or whatever the scientists in their great wisdom decide is best.

    By not discriminating collars or not scientists get a truer picture of mortality outside the park's boundaries or resident wolves don't you think?

    Until you can understand the scientific conservation reason for hunting you will only become saddened and even angry over issues wildlife.

    How big is your personal carbon footprint?

    by ban nock on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 02:23:38 PM PST

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    •  Nope (8+ / 0-)

      I understand scientific wildlife management just fine.  Hunting wolves is a political issue, not a scientific one.  Wolves are back on the list of game species because of the strength of the rancher lobby, libertarian republicanism in western states, and the chronic long-term dislike on the part of Idaho and Wyoming conservative republicans for anything that looks or smells like environmentalism.  Rational game management would give the wolves more time to repopulate, more space in which to repopulate, and if we absolutely had to allow people to get their jollies from shooting large predators, would target a whole lot less than 140 or whatever the total number of kills allocated for MN or MT/ID/WY.

      Hunting overpopulated game species such as deer, and hunting invastives such as feral hogs is rational and even laudatory.  I'll go along with RKBA and I'll go along with subsistence hunting and even sports hunting by people who respect the animal enough to eat it.  Hunting apex predators is a shameful and embarrasing thing for grown men to do. Just is.  Track wolves, watch them, track mountain lions on foot without the help of a bunch of dogs.  Shoot them?  Nope.  Not going to change my mind on that.  If ranchers don't like it, they should understand healthy predator populations are the price they need to pay for grazing public land.  If it helps to sooth their hurt then reimburse them for predator kills.  But I'm not at all sympathetic to the lobbying to hunt predators pushed by ranching interests.

      “If the misery of the poor be caused not by the laws of nature, but by our institutions, great is our sin.” Charles Darwin

      by ivorybill on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 03:21:02 PM PST

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      •  You will continue to be upset until you educate (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        frankzappatista

        yourself a little about wildlife management. I've given you a place to start but I can do nothing about a closed mind. Labeling scientific management a Republican issue is kind of silly, it's a universally understood concept out west, Republicans, Democrats, liberals, conservatives. We all might argue about politics out here but westerners are into protecting and preserving species.

        How big is your personal carbon footprint?

        by ban nock on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 04:17:23 PM PST

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      •  Damn! We have a winner n/t (0+ / 0-)
    •  Biologists did not recommend wolf killing (6+ / 0-)

      The laws enabling this wolf killing were pushed by ranchers.

      There is no scientific rationale for this fall's wolf killings on the Yellowstone Park boundary. Aldo Leopold has nothing to do with this. Nothing.

      You are discrediting yourself by making such disingenuous arguments.

      look for my eSci diary series Thursday evening.

      by FishOutofWater on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 03:48:26 PM PST

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      •  Biologists inform the scientific management of all (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        frankzappatista

        species in all states. Might want to visit your own states division of wildlife and ask them how they come to decisions about wildlife.

        Might want to get a copy of that link from the library go to the very long chapter on predator management and get back to me.

        Please don't talk of discrediting myself and I'll promise not to laugh.

        How big is your personal carbon footprint?

        by ban nock on Mon Dec 10, 2012 at 04:27:25 PM PST

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