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View Diary: School Shooting in CT (367 comments)

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  •  I usually stay out of the gun topics... (21+ / 0-)

    ...but this tragedy (and ones like it) underscores the problem with one of the most common anti-gun-control arguments: that an armed population will reduce gun violence by having the ability to neutralize a rogue shooter.

    In times like this, though, it doesn't matter how many guns we sell, or how easy we make it for people to carry them.

    Elementary school kids can't shoot back.

    There have to be alternatives.

    "All opinions are not equal. Some are a very great deal more robust, sophisticated and well supported in logic and argument than others." -Douglas Adams

    by Serpents Choice on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 08:36:30 AM PST

    •  Not a common argument at all. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      PavePusher

      In fact, it's the first I'm ever hearing of it.  There have been arguments over specific incidents--some with armed defenders presents, others without.  And since this events are so damningly rare and unique, there is no serious argument that any macropolicy will have an affect on their incidence.

      Wouldn't be so sure about elementary school kids, but that's not the point.  I think we can limit our discussion to armed adults.

      •  It is, though. (9+ / 0-)

        It's probably not a common argument here.  I respectfully disagree with many of the positions of Daily Kos's RKBA advocates, but they do try very hard to present logical and defensible positions for their stance.

        This is not a logical argument, but it's one that gets made every time there's a shooting in a "gun-free zone", every time there's a shooting where concealed carry was banned, or where there just happened to be no guns present.  I'm not going to link to these arguments; I will not give the people and forums responsible any more web traffic, but you should be able to find them without too much trouble.

        It happens every time.  It happened with Aurora.  It happened with the Sikh Temple shooting.  It has already happened here -- see Bryan Fischer's tweet upthread.  A minute on Google reveals that there are even people, disgustingly, making the argument that an armed European Jewish populace would have stopped the Holocaust by shooting all the Nazis.

        It is a reprehensible argument, in any form.  But here, when the victims are this young, it is more easily revealed for what it is.

        "All opinions are not equal. Some are a very great deal more robust, sophisticated and well supported in logic and argument than others." -Douglas Adams

        by Serpents Choice on Fri Dec 14, 2012 at 09:01:35 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Where is it a common argument? (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          PavePusher

          In criminology literature?  Hell, even in gun rights advocacy?  Where?

          You've written very eloquently on parsing scientific writing, so I find it disconcerting that you're debating such an obvious strawman.  I appreciate that you exclude RKBA from people you say advance this argument, but I can find no evidence that of anyone in dKos orbit or beyond of any consequence saying such a thing.

          There are people, including myself, who will make certain operational and tactical observations on a case by case basis.  It's not in principle a reprehensible thing to do; but you'll forgive me if I ask you to provide specific examples of arguments you find offensive.  Perhaps they truly are.  And perhaps you're reading too much into them.

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