Skip to main content

View Diary: Is It Moral? (39 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  That's true, (0+ / 0-)

    but I'm not veery happy about what I am hearing.  I consider myself to have been very pragmatic.  I like President Obama, do not consider him to have betrayed us, but don't like this deal.  Is it the worst possible deal?  No.  But I don't think it is good either.  

    Join us on the Black Kos front porch to review news and views written from a black pov—everyone is welcome.

    by TomP on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 08:51:29 AM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  That's fair (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      TomP

      But I'm having trouble imagining what a good deal would look like. I don't think it exists.

      You never trust a millionaire/Quoting the sermon on the mount/I used to think I was not like them/But I'm beginning to have my doubts -- The Arcade Fire

      by tomjones on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 09:02:45 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  We could start by addressing only the things (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        TomP, blueoasis

        that contribute to the deficit.  Social Security would not be one of them.

        •  Good idea (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          TomP

          But it's too logical to be acceptable to Republicans.

          I don't know, I think by preferring a deal to no deal I'm just in the minority on this site. Won't be the last time. ;)

          You never trust a millionaire/Quoting the sermon on the mount/I used to think I was not like them/But I'm beginning to have my doubts -- The Arcade Fire

          by tomjones on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 09:13:05 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  A deal is ok, depending on what the terms are. (0+ / 0-)

            I don't like the terms now, but since Boehner rejected, they can only get worse for Dems if there is a deal.  I hope this wwas the last, best offer, but I fear it is not.

            Join us on the Black Kos front porch to review news and views written from a black pov—everyone is welcome.

            by TomP on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 09:16:34 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Yup, that is the rub (0+ / 0-)

              As you note in your Krugman diary, there is definitely a point where a deal is worse than no deal, and if we aren't there now we are fast approaching it.

              You never trust a millionaire/Quoting the sermon on the mount/I used to think I was not like them/But I'm beginning to have my doubts -- The Arcade Fire

              by tomjones on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 10:37:28 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

          •  If the republicans want to set fire to the room, (0+ / 0-)

            and they make a proposal of "burn the entire nation to the ground", does that make "give them a book of matches" a good counter-offer, or would we be better just negotiating from the starting point of "No matches for you"?

            Because this is about more than the specific cliff issue.  It's about the Republicans having a general policy of wanting Democrats to bow before their supposedly greater hyper-masculine macho power.  It has little to do with which policies are of concern at the moment; if it isn't a fiscal cliff, it's something else.

            They need to be called out publicly on their lack of decency, and just told "no, your starting point isn't worthy of the attention of intelligent, caring, moral people."

            I feel that even though it will hurt many many millions of people to go over that cliff, we should.  It took over 50 years for the Republicans to get a stranglehold on things.  We need to be working on a 50-year strategy to pull it back.  And to do that we need some base principles, chief among them "I do not negotiate with terrorists."  If we never stand for anything, they just keep pulling the starting point of negotiations closer to them.

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site