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View Diary: Psssst ... Biden. Can you have a word with the boss about promises? (193 comments)

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  •  Congressional Dems do nt (3+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    bryduck, cocinero, kj in missouri

    I hope that the quality of debate will improve,
    but I fear we will remain Democrats.

    by twigg on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 01:37:10 PM PST

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    •  It seems clear to me that (14+ / 0-)

      Obama doesn't care about them or their chances. I think his actions in 2008-2010 provides supporting evidence for that assertion.

      "Lone catch of the moon, the roots of the sigh of an idea there will be the outcome may be why?"--from a spam diary entitled "The Vast World."

      by bryduck on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 01:38:21 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  You can't have it both ways (4+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        jrooth, commonmass, ebrann, kj in missouri

        You just said he has no more campaigns to run, yet in 2010 he clearly did.

        You knew we were electing a Centerist compromiser. Nothing has changed.

        My dismay at this compromise is simply that it makes no sense. I never had any doubts that I wouldn't like much about the deal that would be reached.

        I hope that the quality of debate will improve,
        but I fear we will remain Democrats.

        by twigg on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 01:41:11 PM PST

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        •  Two statements, two points. (5+ / 0-)

          You talked about supporting him now, I said he doesn't need it.
          You talked about Congress, I said he doesn't care about it now, either, as evidenced by the fact that he didn't care about it then, when he should have cared. I think that is consistent . . .

          "Lone catch of the moon, the roots of the sigh of an idea there will be the outcome may be why?"--from a spam diary entitled "The Vast World."

          by bryduck on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 01:44:37 PM PST

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      •  it seems to me he talks a good game for the dems (5+ / 0-)

        and then he goes and works for the rethugs

      •  It's not that he didn't care about Dem chances... (5+ / 0-)

        but that he and his advisers grossly miscalculated their approach to "reforming" health care.

        They backed a largely unpopular plan.  A plan developed originally by conservatives.  So they carried conservative water, got branded as rampant socialists, cost themselves the House and almost the Senate, and let the astro-turf Tea Party take up the mantle of populism.  All by completely misreading the public, the problem and the extent of Republican obstructionism.

        Their 11th-dimensiony chess failed badly.  Rahm Emmanuel/Barack Obama pseudo-pragmatism was a failure in both politics and policy.

        It wasn't until Occupy that any of this started to turn around and issues like taxes on the wealthy and talk of income gaps started to peak out their foxholes.  It took a legit popular uprising to get these clowns to realize that the public doesn't want them to give away the store to the wealthy and powerful.

        Have they learned their lesson?  We'll see.  If they're playing a game with this offer, they may well be shooting all of us in the foot.  Obama's Dems have now put SS cuts on the table.  Democrats offering up SS cuts to pay for tax cuts for the wealthy.  They will be responsible if those cuts come to pass and that will come home to roost in following elections.  Permanent SS cuts offered up to "resolve" a pseudo-crisis that will rear it's head again in a couple years.

        All over a non-crisis ginned up to protect the wealth of the wealthy from being taxed at rates that were too low 20 years ago.  Hopefully he realizes that's not a great legacy to leave behind.

        The American people won't reward these kinds of unnecessary compromises.  They will reward bold leadership that protects and helps the middle/working class, the elderly, and the poor.

        What's wrong under Republicans is still wrong under Democrats.

        by gila on Tue Dec 18, 2012 at 02:48:48 PM PST

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        •  Just about everyone here (0+ / 0-)

          who doesn't subscribe to the 11th D chess scenario understood this, but no one on Obama's team did? Not very likely, especially when polls showed people were much farther to the left of him, even at the very time he was negotiating!

          "Lone catch of the moon, the roots of the sigh of an idea there will be the outcome may be why?"--from a spam diary entitled "The Vast World."

          by bryduck on Wed Dec 19, 2012 at 11:58:56 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

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