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View Diary: Daily Kos Elections Live Digest: 12/31 (149 comments)

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  •  Foreign elections to watch in 2013 (5+ / 0-)

    Foreign Policy has a list of eight international elections to watch.

    22, male, new CA-18 (home and voting there), new LA-01 (college)

    by Jeff Singer on Mon Dec 31, 2012 at 10:29:24 AM PST

    •  I really do wish that the American left would (2+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Inoljt, Taget

      take more of an interest in international elections and perhaps try to coordinate with those parties.  Obviously this would be rather contentious since the Democratic party is well to the right of a lot of the center-left and left of center parties elsewhere in the developed world, but in times like this (after a major election) it seems like there are plenty of liberal activists here with not much else to do so why not help in other parts of the world.  That and it just makes sense to care about the policy outcomes around the world if your party is invested in caring about the poor and disadvantaged since most of the poor live in other countries.

      NC-06/NC-04; -9.12, -8.62; Yellow Dog Democrat

      by sawolf on Mon Dec 31, 2012 at 11:46:16 AM PST

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      •  the American left doesn't even pay enough (15+ / 0-)

        attention to American politics.

        ...better the occasional faults of a government that lives in a spirit of charity, than the consistent omissions of a government frozen in the ice of its own indifference. -FDR, 1936

        by James Allen on Mon Dec 31, 2012 at 11:50:33 AM PST

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      •  Probably not a good idea. (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Taget, MichaelNY, betelgeux

        People don't like it when foreigners get involved in their elections.

        http://mypolitikal.com/

        by Inoljt on Mon Dec 31, 2012 at 12:48:48 PM PST

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      •  The problem is they don't necessarily collate. (3+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        NMLib, James Allen, MichaelNY

        And the issues are different.

        One way to explain it is to look at how outsiders view our elections.  They will see the two parties and how they view say Iraq or Afghanistan or relations with the rest of the world and use that to gauge the United States.  When we rarely if ever vote based on foreign policy.  You can debate how much we even vote based on domestic economic policy.

        Or Israel where us outsiders like to pretend everything is about peace,war, and the Palestinians when there is a complex assortment of other issues and even ethno-linguistic considerations that swings elections.

        Above beyond that the spectrum is different.  The leftist parties in Europe are far to the left of the Democratic Party.  You can make a good case so are the centrist and conservative parties as well.  I look at say Nicholas Sarcozy and David Cameroon and I can only wish we had someone who held their views on universal healthcare and a host of other matters.  While I might want to change the skew of the current tax system I am not in favor of Francois Hollande's top rate of 75%.  A lot (though certainly not all) on the United States left would probably agree with me on that.

        I do think however both on the left and America in general we do ignore the political and policy debates of Europe, Asia, and elsewhere far too much.  What made America great is that we shameless pilfered and stole the best from the rest of the world.  Our founding fathers were not afraid to even look at Native American political structures (such as the Iroquois Confederation) for inspiration.  A far cry from the literal know-nothingism frequently seen on the right.

        The lady was enchanted and said they ought to see. So they charged her with subversion and made her watch TV -Spirogyra

        by Taget on Mon Dec 31, 2012 at 02:47:37 PM PST

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        •  I think in Europe it's more complicated... (4+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          James Allen, Taget, MichaelNY, MetroGnome
          Above beyond that the spectrum is different.  The leftist parties in Europe are far to the left of the Democratic Party.  You can make a good case so are the centrist and conservative parties as well.  I look at say Nicholas Sarcozy and David Cameroon and I can only wish we had someone who held their views on universal healthcare and a host of other matters.  While I might want to change the skew of the current tax system I am not in favor of Francois Hollande's top rate of 75%.  A lot (though certainly not all) on the United States left would probably agree with me on that.
          They may be to our left on economic issues, but that doesn't necessarily apply to all issues, particularly immigration. Need we forget this gem from one of Switzerland's parties:

          Politics and more Formerly DGM on SSP. NM-01, 26 (chairman of the Atheist Caucus)

          by NMLib on Mon Dec 31, 2012 at 03:05:49 PM PST

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          •  Even on immigration there is a different debate. (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            NMLib, MichaelNY

            In the United States the issue is how do you normalize those who are already working and secure the borders and make everyone go through legal channels.  Us on the left here realize they are already tightly integrated into the economy and we cannot deport them even if we wanted to.  So the best thing to do to protect the wages of legal workers and protect the economy is to make them full citizens.  And try to penalize employers who are trying to pay sub-standard wages to undocumented aliens to encourage everyone to seek legal controlled channels.

            Republicans would prefer an expanded guest worker system where employers could sub-minimum wages legally.  And to throw everyone out who is not part of it.

            In Europe it's about invoking "asylum" where at it's most extreme anyone (often from the Middle East) could claim legal status by just saying their home country is rotten.  Leading to very rapid demographic changes which of course feeds the xenophobes.  Our views are not necessarily that of the left in Europe even if we're appalled by the open racism of the far right.   Of course few nations are at that extreme (and most were not even close) anymore thanks to reforms of their asylum system.. some of which were supported by left-wing parties.  But it is a different argument involving a different system that depending on the country would seem foreign and strange to us.

            Put us over there and we'd probably want to put in OUR system.  Despite the fact what we have now clearly does not even work in our own country.

            But I do take your point.  There are commonalities of interest.  And at the very least the arguments the left in the US and abroad face and return tend to be similar and there is room to work together on different issues.

            The lady was enchanted and said they ought to see. So they charged her with subversion and made her watch TV -Spirogyra

            by Taget on Mon Dec 31, 2012 at 03:59:08 PM PST

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        •  "stealing" is not quite stealing (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          Taget, MichaelNY

          when people from those countries often brought them here.  

          ...better the occasional faults of a government that lives in a spirit of charity, than the consistent omissions of a government frozen in the ice of its own indifference. -FDR, 1936

          by James Allen on Mon Dec 31, 2012 at 03:47:56 PM PST

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    •  Foreign Policy is a GREAT magazine. (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      betelgeux

      If I had to pick only two general interest publications to get my news from it would be The Economist and Foreign Policy.

      The lady was enchanted and said they ought to see. So they charged her with subversion and made her watch TV -Spirogyra

      by Taget on Mon Dec 31, 2012 at 02:16:59 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

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