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View Diary: President Obama torpedos Biden/McConnell deal??? (192 comments)

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  •  So the increased leverage with the new senate/Hous (3+ / 0-)

    That will help us if we go over the cliff won't help us in the sequester?

    I dont like everything about the deal but I feel like there is some severe magical thinking here.  

    •  agreed, we don't gain much (0+ / 0-)

      it seems republicans really want us to go over the cliff.

      remember they created it.  they will get something or we will get nothing.

      -You want to change the system, run for office.

      by Deep Texan on Mon Dec 31, 2012 at 12:02:38 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  The nature of the problem changes. (11+ / 0-)

      Again, once you go over the cliff, the CBO projects wipe the deficit right on out.

      Seriously. You just don't have a deficit problem anymore. You don't need to cut social security. You need to make a few minor changes in Medicare and Medicaid. But you don't need to drastically cut anything else because the revenues are there. See what I mean?

      But what you have then is an economic slowdown. So you deal with that how? By passing a tax cut coupled with some spending...spending that you can now put through because you've GOT THE REVENUE. So if I had to gamble on the GOP...i'd be gambling on them voting for a tax cut rather than a tax increase as you all seem to be cheering for.

      So, if you just love president obama more than anything on gods green earth, then yes, support him in whatever he does without question.

      But if you want growth and protection for entitlements, go over the cliff obviously.

      •  Well I would argue (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Vote4Obamain2012, MRA NY

        Actually we will have a deficit problem because if the cliff starts to send us into a recession we will again have an issue with decreased revenue with the need for increased spending.  So we will be right there again.

        I do'nt just love him more than God's Green Earth. I just don't necessarily see that the deal is that much better on either side and I think that messaging is on our side a heck of a lot more now than it will be later. You can disagree with which side has more leverage that doesn't mean you're an Obama hater anymore than I blindly agree with him.

        •  leverage (0+ / 0-)

          the republicans would not be in that much worse shape after the tax cuts expire. They can simply put forward a bill to cut taxes on everybody making less than $500K and dare Democrats to vote against it. Revenue bills must originate in the House unless the Speaker chooses to take steps to alleviate that necessity.

          President Obama and Democrats may actually do what they say- not pass (or in the President's case - veto) bills that are not balanced. He would say we got those tax cuts for free. That was the middle class. Or were you really opposed to those tax cuts for the middle class and only supported tax cuts for the wealthy. So, the President and Congressional Dems can stop any bills that simply cut spending without raising new revenue. And they can win that battle politically as well.

          Therefore, BBB's position (which simply assumes the contrary) is probably incorrect. Not saying that his view should not be considered, but simply that in my estimation it is far from conclusive.

      •  Great comment (0+ / 0-)

        I wish we could see it laid out like this more often.  

        Tomorrow, the nature of the problem changes, can be reframed -- if the Democrats allow it to.

        "Justice is a commodity"

        by joanneleon on Mon Dec 31, 2012 at 06:44:33 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

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