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  •  that is funny. He got what he wanted? (5+ / 0-)

    He said 4 years ago and this year that he wanted 250k.  He went up to 450k.  That is an 80% increase and it covers lots of taxpayers and represents lots of lost revenue.

    I am not moving any goalposts.  I was responding to a question about how my suggestion would work.  I gave an answer.  Not sure that was moving goal posts.  

    •  yes yes yes (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      sethtriggs

      we COMPROMISED on that (look it up) because we don't have the house

      Further it's for a year hardly as much revenue as you think and yes you are moving the goal posts.

      Obama got just about everything he wanted by one compromise. And frankly any reasonable person would know that we were going to have to give the GOP something. I consider this to be an incredibly small price to pay considering they started off with chained CPI and a 65 to 67 age raise.

      You can acknowledge this yes?

      •  go back to my original comment please (0+ / 0-)

        I know he compromised so don't insult my intelligence with capital letters.

        And please don't keep repeating your talking point about how I am moving goalposts with explaining how.

        Now, I said the negotiation was failed because the President started with his preferred outcome of 250k.  I know he compromised to 450.  But when you go into any negotiation you don't start with your bottom line.  You start somewhere else to get to your bottom line.

        so if you are saying the President's bottom line was 450 that is fine.  If that is not the case he failed in negotiating tactics.  all I pointed out was that he could have started with a lower number and worked his way up to 250.  No reasonable person is going to say that 150 is middle class.  Many people would say it, but no reasonable person who understands the economy and statistics.

        •  gods that is one of the most (0+ / 0-)

          screwed up definitions of 'failure' i can think of

          Something was going to have to give and that's waht he chose. Frankly I don't think you understand the concept of negotiation.

          •  you don't seem to have read (0+ / 0-)

            or understood my comments.  At this point I can only ask you to read them.  Thanks

            •  oh I read them and understand them (0+ / 0-)

              I just think it's one of the worst examples of lucy swiping the football at the last second I can think of recently

              •  let me try this again (0+ / 0-)

                and perhaps you would do me the favor or responding to my points rather than making unsubstantiated assertions.

                You said the President got everything he wanted.

                I pointed out that in a negotiation, if you start with your bottom line, you will not get what you want after any compromise.  If you start with your bottom line you won't get it if the other side has any skill or will at all.

                Let's say my bottom line is tax cuts end at 250k.  If I start at 250 and negotiate to 450 then how did I get "everything I wanted"?  You said he got everything he wanted.  I simply pointed out that either
                a) he did not get everything he wanted
                or b) he really wanted 450k so he started the negotiations at 250k
                My point is, if he really wanted 250k he
                a) did not get what he wanted, and
                b) then by definition the negotiation was not successful.
                It is straightforward.  If you being a negotiation with your bottom line you are not going to get what you want.

                •  I never said the president got everything he wante (0+ / 0-)

                  what I said was that the president got what he set out for at the begining of December, middle class tax cuts. He also along the way got a lot of green energy tax incentives along with rate hikes for the rich.

                  And for that all he 'paid' was a relatively small compromise on the 250k line for a year

                  What is so hard to understand that?

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