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View Diary: Gingrich says Republicans will 'cave' on their 'dead loser' debt limit bluff (177 comments)

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  •  I just took a look (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    wwjjd, SilentBrook

    at the Wiki page for the  Budget Control Act of 2011 that raised the debt ceiling. Here's the final vote in the house:

    The House passed the Budget Control Act[1] on August 1, 2011 by a vote of 269–161. 174 Republicans and 95 Democrats voted for it, while 66 Republicans and 95 Democrats voted against it.
    So you're right, there's a precedent for this. But note the GOP breakdown, 174 for and 66 against. I don't expect there to be anywhere near this many for any debt ceiling bill that doesn't include major cuts to entitlements. Unless Obama caves, they're going to need lots of Dems, nearly all of them most likely. Pelosi will likely try to get unanimity to support Obama, and she'll likely get it.

    Ok, that asshole Jim Cooper and maybe a couple of other deficit scolds might vote against it. You got me there.

    "Liberty without virtue would be no blessing to us" - Benjamin Rush, 1777

    by kovie on Fri Jan 04, 2013 at 09:08:41 AM PST

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    •  How do we game this out? We shouldn't negotiate (0+ / 0-)

      over the debt ceiling at all. But we have weak Democrats, like Steny Hoyer, who are afraid to vote for a clean hike because the vote will be used against them in the next election. Maybe, not likely, the WH takes some action on their own so Dems don't have to vote on the debt ceiling. Regardless, I don't want Democrats voting for any bill that cuts SS, Medicare, or Medicaid benefits in any hell with what the President or VP may eventually negotiate. So, absent the WH doing something on its own what are we left with? Some straight bull!

      Anyway, thanks. It's been great going back re-reading the foolishness of 2011. :-(

      •  I say enough of this love affair (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        Cambridgemac, slinkerwink

        that centrist Dems like Hoyer & Obama have been having with centrist voters over fiscal issues, since they represent relatively few true swing votes as most of them vote GOP no matter what, and passing conservative bills to cater to them not only doesn't work and isn't necessary politically, but results in awful policies and loses them much more support on the left than they gain in the center, 2010 being a classic and tragic example.

        Triangulation has been a colossal failure and we need to abandon it. To hell with those illusory centrist voters. They're not worth the bother. Dems win or lose depending on how progressive they are.

        "Liberty without virtue would be no blessing to us" - Benjamin Rush, 1777

        by kovie on Fri Jan 04, 2013 at 09:48:15 AM PST

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