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View Diary: Birch Society Republicans: America Now Has Three Major Political Parties (425 comments)

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  •  Flouride in water...huh (1+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    bontemps2012

    I prefer to brush my teeth with flouride,  not drink it. That makes me bircher? not to be confused with birther

    I guess not wanting to drink  Neurotoxins now puts you in the category of "crazy". Weird...

    You know we live in strange times when hearing something as simple as the truth almost seems shocking.

    by redhaze on Sat Jan 05, 2013 at 02:37:04 AM PST

    •  Do yourself a favor (10+ / 0-)

      and take a pharmacology class. You might benefit from learning about the concept of dosage.

      Research science: a series of failures sporadically punctuated by success

      by dpryan on Sat Jan 05, 2013 at 05:00:45 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

    •  Believe the science: use fluoride toothpaste (8+ / 0-)

      then you have more of the chemical in your system than you will ever get from drinking treated drinking water.

      The levels are different by two orders of magnitude. Fluoride also mixes instantly with your saliva.

      The level in drinking water is miniscule.

      "We have done nothing to be ashamed of. We have nothing to apologize for." NRA 12/14/2012

      by bontemps2012 on Sat Jan 05, 2013 at 05:39:35 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  One you drink, one you spit out (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        bontemps2012

        There is also the issue of being forced to use one and not the other.

        Even if you suppose that there is nothing wrong with consuming and digesting minimal amounts of a known neurotoxin over long periods of time (which for some segment of the population will not end well, see the literature on xray's applied over a broad enough segment of the population as one example), there is also the issue of choice. People should be allowed to choose what they put in their body to the greatest extent possible, end of the day.

        I think its fair to disagree, but a Bircher I am not

        You know we live in strange times when hearing something as simple as the truth almost seems shocking.

        by redhaze on Sat Jan 05, 2013 at 11:01:29 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Where's the literature on flouride? (2+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          redhaze, bontemps2012

          Its been around long enough now, where are the negative consequences?

          There is truth on all sides. The question is how much.

          by slothlax on Sat Jan 05, 2013 at 11:34:01 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Surpisingly little research (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            slothlax, bontemps2012

            exists in terms of the effects of fluoride on neurological function over long periods of time (which would likely be the primary concern, given that fluoride is an established neurotoxin at higher doses).

            Some animal research does exist to show that there may be cause for concern in terms of low dose fluoride having neurotoxic effects. See here, for example:

            http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/...

            Some studies on the effects of fluoridated public water also show the benefits of fluoridated water on reduction in cavities across the population, which I don't believe is likely to be disputed by either side.

            You know we live in strange times when hearing something as simple as the truth almost seems shocking.

            by redhaze on Sat Jan 05, 2013 at 01:40:05 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Lead, we know about. (1+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              redhaze

              Fluoride, we know about.

              Both have been tracked in 30 years studies.

              Lead is a poison at very, very low levels. Fluoride is not. Towns with naturally high fluoride levels have no elevated neuro problems whatsoever.

              Sometimes a simple chemical is simply good for you.

              "We have done nothing to be ashamed of. We have nothing to apologize for." NRA 12/14/2012

              by bontemps2012 on Sat Jan 05, 2013 at 05:15:02 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  Link please if you don't mind (0+ / 0-)

                Not unsourced statements.

                Almost every piece of research out there  that I have reviewed on the safety and efficacy of flouridated water starts with a statement that says something along the lines of, "The body of evidence available on the efficacy and safety of water fluoridation is limited and of relatively low quality". (not an actual quote, just the gist of what the research tends to report).

                Moreover, the research that does exist tends to focus on two primary issues: 1. The effects on cavity formation and general dental health, which is positive and 2. The effects of flouridation on cancer formation (of which there is no link). The research on neurological issues is virtually non-existant other than a couple studies (one of which I posted above).

                See the conclusions drawn here (a research summary of all literature at the time of its writing) that notes the lack of quality research into the overall health consequences of low level flouride intake:

                http://www.york.ac.uk/...

                Basically, you're not right.

                Two other quick points:

                1. Even if the research was conclusive that there were no ill health effects from low level fluoride intake, it is certainly arguable that it is a violation of individual rights to force people to drink a chemical, irrespective of their want or desire to do so. And this goes for anyone who is poor, doesn't want to drink fluoride, but can't afford purified water (most of which, admittedly, has fluoride in it anyway

                and

                2. Not wanting to drink fluoride does not make you equivalent or equal to some Birch society loon! Christ sake mate, you are just way off base on that. If you were to just give me that point, I would happily agree to disagree on all the others. Cheers!

                You know we live in strange times when hearing something as simple as the truth almost seems shocking.

                by redhaze on Sat Jan 05, 2013 at 06:23:46 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

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