Skip to main content

View Diary: New German Data Shows No End in Sight for Coal (230 comments)

Comment Preferences

  •  That means we should question their approach (2+ / 0-)
    Recommended by:
    Roadbed Guy, Odysseus

    Coal is the enemy both in terms of public health and long-term climate change.  Germany has made more out of pushing to renewables than any other nation and the results... more coal with no end in sight to fossil fuel emissions.  

    So, what this means is that maybe this in not how we do it and we should be thinking long and hard about going all-in for wind and solar when the objective is to eliminate Big Fossil from primary energy production.  

    The fact their increase in coal use mirrors their reduction in  nuclear generation highlights a key point: coal and nuclear are interchangeable baseload sources as far as the grid is concerned, except nuclear emits zero GHG and coal is the worst possible emitter of GHG.

    The intrinsic nature of Power is such that those who seek it most are least qualified to wield it.

    by mojo workin on Tue Jan 08, 2013 at 12:32:09 PM PST

    [ Parent ]

    •  You confuse coal for baseload generation (1+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      BYw

      Yes Germany should have kept its nukes, but coal is not the only other option.  Concentrated solar with thermal storage, hydro, etc are all better options than coal

      Hay hombres que luchan un dia, y son buenos Hay otros que luchan un año, y son mejores Hay quienes luchan muchos años, y son muy buenos. Pero hay los que luchan toda la vida. Esos son los imprescendibles.

      by Mindful Nature on Tue Jan 08, 2013 at 02:19:47 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

      •  coal appears to be part of the option (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        cynndara

        they're using though.

        just a little bit bored.

        by terrypinder on Tue Jan 08, 2013 at 04:26:16 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Definitely that (0+ / 0-)

          The headlong rush out of nuclear was ill  advised I'm afraid

          Hay hombres que luchan un dia, y son buenos Hay otros que luchan un año, y son mejores Hay quienes luchan muchos años, y son muy buenos. Pero hay los que luchan toda la vida. Esos son los imprescendibles.

          by Mindful Nature on Tue Jan 08, 2013 at 06:58:13 PM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  I think your assessment is a bit premature. (1+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            splashy

            It's too early, and Germany is a pioneer. The experts know themselves there will be mistakes along the way, but that will only benefit those who follow - learning from the mistakes and doing things better.

            „Wer kämpft, kann verlieren. Wer nicht kämpft, hat schon verloren.“ - Bertolt Brecht

            by translatorpro on Wed Jan 09, 2013 at 02:18:53 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

        •  It's not. (3+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          translatorpro, Lawrence, splashy

          Assuming by "option" you mean "baseload".  I'll leave it up to the diarist to clarify whether they deliberately lied or simply didn't read or understand their own links, but the new plants are replacing baseload coal with far more efficient coal peakers.  Replacing with a more efficient version = reducing CO2, not adding, != consuming more coal.  Peakers = gap filling for when the sun isn't shining and the wind isn't blowing, aka, supporting ever-growing wind and solar penetration.  

          They'll probably function as baseload in the early days (they are replacing plants that are currently running as baseload, after all), but they're clear design intent peakers, taking only 15 minutes to ramp up or down - a role that will become increasingly important as solar and wind penetration keep rising.

          •  i'm referring to the fuelsource (0+ / 0-)

            not the baseload.

            Yes, I am of the opinion that coal, as a fuel source, is not a good thing period.

            I don't understand the hate for this diary. It really wasn't that bad, and it isn't explictly pro-nuclear, and actually has praise for renewables.

            just a little bit bored.

            by terrypinder on Wed Jan 09, 2013 at 08:48:45 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  Maybe it isn't "that bad", but it's not the truth, (2+ / 0-)
              Recommended by:
              Lawrence, splashy

              either. It is misrepresenting the facts, or even worse, the diarist is cherry-picking the stuff he likes and leaving out the rest.

              „Wer kämpft, kann verlieren. Wer nicht kämpft, hat schon verloren.“ - Bertolt Brecht

              by translatorpro on Wed Jan 09, 2013 at 02:22:11 PM PST

              [ Parent ]

Subscribe or Donate to support Daily Kos.

Click here for the mobile view of the site