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View Diary: National Cathedral to Perform Same-Sex Weddings (34 comments)

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  •  Forgive the quibble, but cathedrals are not (0+ / 0-)

    agents. They don't do anything but sit in place. A cathedral is a venue.
    People get married. Whether their commitment to each other is witnessed and where it takes place is another matter.

    Any social group shunning people doing good is deplorable. That a religious group intends a change in attitude is welcome as is the return of the prodigal son. But, that's about all.
    Are the rectors of the cathedral going to charge a fee for the use of the venue?

    We organize governments to deliver services and prevent abuse.

    by hannah on Wed Jan 09, 2013 at 03:15:39 AM PST

    •  I'm sorry, but, have you been there? (16+ / 0-)

      This isn't a simple church that's unused five days of the week; the Washington National Cathedral is more of America's monastery (in the sense of a monastery being central to the community around it) than it is a single building. The Cathedral grounds contain a bishop's office and residence, boys and girls schools, and extensive gardens as well as the Cathedral itself. There are two choirs, multiple clergy, and a small staff working there every day. That the "Cathedral" is coming out with this announcement means a large and very visible symbol of the Episcopal church is standing up and doing the right thing. I realize it's unusual to think of the Cathedral as an entityrather than an edifice, but, that's what it is.

      Radarlady, who will be attending a Folger Consort performance there on Saturday night...

      •  Obviously the cathedral did not make the decision (11+ / 0-)

        The people running it did.

        But edifices matter.  Al Qaeda struck down the WTC partly because it was such a visible edifice.

        Thank you, radarlady, for your description of the National Cathedral community - and enjoy the concert!

        www.tapestryofbronze.com

        by chloris creator on Wed Jan 09, 2013 at 03:50:07 AM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Yes, the towers had become iconic, mostly because (0+ / 0-)

          Hollywood really liked featuring them in movies about New York. However, they were also the headquarters of world trade, a system of exploitation behind the facade of the dollar to which exploited populations object. Being myopic, as usual, the citizens of the United States took the assault as a personal attack and, as usual, overreacted. Bin Laden didn't expect all the planes to connect and he was completely mistaken about how the U.S. would react. So, he went into hiding and, as so often happens, lots of innocent people in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan paid with their lives.
          The towers were most visible, but least significant.

          Yes, I've been to the National Cathedral. My mother-in-law lived two blocks away. I understand that many people make establishments of religion the focus of their social lives, but the exclusive behavior of their denizens is not laudable.

          We organize governments to deliver services and prevent abuse.

          by hannah on Wed Jan 09, 2013 at 04:15:46 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  This is a story of inclusion (10+ / 0-)

            So why are you tracking mud all over the carpet here?

            •  Because the focus is on inanimate objects and (0+ / 0-)

              artificial corporations rather than the humans making good decisions. Humans, as agents of good and bad, often get short shrift.
              Besides, a little controversy never hurts when one wants to promote an issue. :)

              We organize governments to deliver services and prevent abuse.

              by hannah on Wed Jan 09, 2013 at 05:18:08 AM PST

              [ Parent ]

              •  A cathedral is also a parish, with priests who (11+ / 0-)

                minister to parishioners. This decision is ultimately about those priests tending to the humans in their care, deciding to administer one of the holy sacraments to EVERYONE, regardless of sexual orientation.

                This IS about humans making excellent decisions. This is NOT about a fucking building.

                Ho'oponopono. To make things right; restore harmony; heal.

                by earicicle on Wed Jan 09, 2013 at 05:32:59 AM PST

                [ Parent ]

              •  This is extremely inaccurate (2+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:
                radarlady, jayden

                sociology that you are peddling.  Neither this story nor the comments (with the exception of yours) are focusing on inanimate objects.  They are focusing on an important social institution and you are being annoyingly pedantic in order to make what is, in sociological terms, an inaccurate (and rather petty) point.

                Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

                by a gilas girl on Wed Jan 09, 2013 at 07:21:31 AM PST

                [ Parent ]

          •  see my comment above (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            radarlady, susanala

            you have a conceptual error in your comment about The Cathedral not being an agent.  "The Cathedral" is an institution as the response comment indicates, though doesn't state directly, and thus as an institution, "The Cathedral (or the National Cathedral, it's campus, associated organizations, and the role that it's leaders and the community it represents all play in that institution) IS, in fact an agent.

            That's just basic sociology: institutions are social actors and agents for either change or the maintenance of the status quo.

            Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

            by a gilas girl on Wed Jan 09, 2013 at 07:20:07 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

        •  To be fair, (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:
          radarlady

          I think the point of the above comment is that "The Cathedral" is an institution, and institutions ARE agents. So there was a conceptual  error in the first comment that inspired the thread.

          Words can sometimes, in moments of grace, attain the quality of deeds. --Elie Wiesel

          by a gilas girl on Wed Jan 09, 2013 at 07:16:48 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

    •  What the hell? (4+ / 0-)
      Recommended by:
      Darmok, susanala, jayden, radarlady

      a) This kind of acceptance is exactly what we are fighting for.  This is another small but symbolic step in a path toward equality.  This is one more institution, and a prominent one at that, that has voluntarily chosen to be on the right side of this issue. This provides leadership and cover for other regional institutions to do likewise.

      b) Of course they will charge a fee, as every venue does.  Though it is nearly nominal if you are a member of their parish.  The National Cathedral serves DC and several neighboring counties in Maryland.

      c) The timing is not suspect here as DC only relatively recently legalized (and then affirmed that decision in a court challenge) same-sex marriage so this was a present-day decision facing the Reverend of the Cathedral... and, while not a member of the parish, but as a neighbor of the beautiful building, I am very glad they decided this way.

      Красота спасет мир --F. Dostoevsky

      by Wisper on Wed Jan 09, 2013 at 07:54:54 AM PST

      [ Parent ]

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