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View Diary: The White House Rejects Solutions to the Mess it Made. We Will Pay for it With Austerity (220 comments)

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  •  priceman - You know that you and I are on (3+ / 0-)
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    priceman, TheMomCat, Wolf10

    the same side in the larger argument and that I'm all about HVPCS but I do thing Theston has a point here. Politically, this was too radical for Boehner to move on is such a short time but  I do think there were huge advantages for him and I don't think he is stupid (corrupt and evil but not stupid).

    The idea of the PC has now entered the zeitgeist (thanks in no small part to several of the people here at dKos who have been blogging and tweeting and talking their hearts out on this issue since long before I even knew MMT existed.) The conversation WILL continue. I, for one, would love to see a panel on it at the upcoming NN 13. I think HVPCS has the ability to open policy space for progressives that is unprecedented in our lifetimes and we need to get informed and organized quickly around this fact. Here's why - now that the possibility is known, our opponents, and here I am talking about bankers and the 1% execs and the mega-corporations - now that the possibility is known they are already paying attention. They can already taste the profits that would result from their efforts to shape the HVPCS to their advantage. Once I realized this I suddenly understood that HVPCS IS going to happen. It IS. Bohener IS going to be a HUGE proponent of it...for all the wrong reasons. It will be up to us to make the counter argument and because there is still air around this issue and because the GOP is not yet in lock step - our time to shape this conversation is right now.

    One small framing point, we need to realize that, for once, we are out in front of an issue THEY are going to support and time is of the essence in terms of framing the meme prior to THEM taking hold of it. Just remember how much the framing of "right to life" has cost us. The meme is ALL and we need to focus in tightly and fiercely.

    OH - and one last thing - if anyone else is interested in thinking about proposing a panel for NN 13 on this subject, please contact me (ArlissBunny@earthlink.net). I can at least facilitate setting up an organizing conversation so that we can figure out our best options.

    "When in doubt, do the brave thing." - Jan Smuts

    by bunnygirl60 on Wed Jan 16, 2013 at 11:30:00 AM PST

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    •  I appreciate you weighing in (2+ / 0-)
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      TheMomCat, ek hornbeck

      and would love to see a panel on it at the upcoming NN 13, though I don't agree about that. I think the 1% bond holders are happy with their interest earning issued bonds issued mainly for their benefit as they are not much use now as a practical monetary policy tool.

      I don't believe Boehner has any interest in this or will ever, though we are mostly in agreement.

      I don't negotiate grand bargains with deficit terrorists!

      by priceman on Wed Jan 16, 2013 at 12:12:05 PM PST

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      •  You don't think the defense contractors and (1+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        priceman

        and big oil and all their friends and cohorts don't have designs on TRILLIONS of dollars? You don't think banks want the business that would be derived from that activity? I think those guys would sell the souls of their children for a piece of this pie. (So we need to make sure they don't get it.)

        "When in doubt, do the brave thing." - Jan Smuts

        by bunnygirl60 on Wed Jan 16, 2013 at 05:58:13 PM PST

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        •  Well they can't get it by design (0+ / 0-)

          It has to be appropriated by Congress to be released by the TGA though I'm sure they would want a trillion dollars. It's still about passing a trillion dollar appropriation through Congress and John Boehner himself and Boehner's constituency still rails about the 787 billion in the stimulus.

          They have their footing in the bond market where we create money to be lent back to us while paying all of them interest on the bonds we don't have to issue. They would have to find other dollars assets with PCS which is mainly for public debt appropriations yet safe. I'm sure defense contractors would also love all the reserves parked at the accounts at the Fed but don't have direct access to them. Banks would love that activity if Congress passed another trillion dollar appropriation as they did for the Iraq and Afghanistan wars which are above 5 trillion but they would have to convince Congress to pass those appropriations and the public is war weary.

          Democrats are more up with the TDC(what I saw merely as a starting point) and Jerold Nadler even had it in his proposal. So I think Republicans would rather keep using the debt as a fear mongering tool rather than change their rhetoric and go for high value PCS which they don't understand given their rhetoric about the amount of platinum in the coin. This is why I am saying I don't see that point and am more angry none of this is being considered as debt will continue to be used like the debt ceiling and what is based on the sequestration.

          I don't negotiate grand bargains with deficit terrorists!

          by priceman on Wed Jan 16, 2013 at 10:48:42 PM PST

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