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  •  You guys are giddy. (6+ / 0-)

    Comparing Obama to Lincoln?

    Well, Lincoln was tall and thin, too, so I guess you could make that comparison.

    At the very least, Lincoln had a better speech writer.

    Not to mention the proven leadership of carrying the country through a long and bitter war with itself, and yet --

    maintaining the conviction that, once the war was over, the war was over.  No revenge was to sought against the South.

    And there was that little matter of freeing the slaves.

    Obama looks real good to you guys because he follows in the footsteps of George W. Bush.

    Nice guy, smart fellow.
    Get outta here.

    LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

    by dinotrac on Sun Jan 27, 2013 at 06:44:57 PM PST

    •  Really? (16+ / 0-)

      How many Presidents talked about doing something big on health care and failed? Six, isn't it?

      How many talked about doing something big on energy and reducing oil dependence and failed? At least the last six. Obama got it done.

      How many Presidents promised to end a war and actually did it? None that I can think of.

      The Consumer Financial Protection Bureau and lending regulation represent the most significant restrictions put on Wall Street since FDR.

      Obama has already done enough to rank as one of the best Presidents in history, succeeding where others have failed.

      •  Oh my. You might want to read some history. (2+ / 0-)
        Recommended by:
        shaharazade, MPociask

        Let's see if Obama can hang with FDR before we start comparing him to Lincoln.  At this point, he's got a ways to go before he can compare to Eisenhower.

        LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

        by dinotrac on Sun Jan 27, 2013 at 07:24:30 PM PST

        [ Parent ]

        •  Did I write something historically inaccurate? (4+ / 0-)

          Please, point it out.
          I think FDR's Presidency was more significant than Obama's, up to this point, but I would reevaluate that if Obama deals effectively with climate change. But, since FDR was the most accomplished President in history, placing Obama behind him still argues for Obama being among the top half dozen.

          •  There is a certain matter of opinion, but I would (2+ / 0-)
            Recommended by:
            Nada Lemming, MPociask

            say this is quite the stretch:

            Obama has already done enough to rank as one of the best Presidents in history, succeeding where others have failed.
            History is the ultimate judge.  Maybe he'll stand tall when all is said and done.

            As to Presidents who promised to end a war and actually did:

            1. Richard Nixon promised to end Vietnam and did.
            2. Eisenhower ran on a platform of ending the Korean war and did.
            3. George Bush should get an assist in Iraq, as he did negotiate a withdrawal schedule.  Obama sped it up.

            LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

            by dinotrac on Sun Jan 27, 2013 at 07:46:46 PM PST

            [ Parent ]

            •  huh (6+ / 0-)

              I did forget about Eisenhower ending the Korean war.

              Vietnam ended while Ford was President, only after a Democratic Congress cut off war funding, and after Nixon secretly expanded the war while claiming to deescalate. I can't credit Nixon for that.

              We don't know what might have happened in Iraq had Bush or another Republican remained President since some in the military were calling for a continuation of the war. That's a stretch. Obama withdrew on the exact time frame he promised during the campaign.

              My view is that most Presidents did more harm than good, and the list of those who had major positive accomplishments in both domestic and foreign policy in one term is very short.

              After Lincoln and FDR, it's pretty hard to come up with Presidents who were much better than Obama. His regulation of wall street is stricter than Teddy Roosevelt's. He's already better than Carter on energy. Johnson did more domestically than Obama so far but killed too many in Vietnam. And half of Obama's first term was spent fixing the messes left behind by Clinton, such as DADT, lending deregulation, and shipping American's manufacturing sector overseas. So, I'm at a loss for why Obama isn't at least in the top five or six best.

              •  Too easy to view past Presidents in terms of (1+ / 0-)
                Recommended by:

                today's issues.  Teddy Roosevelt's trust busting was far more aggressive than Obamas, and his business regulation needs to be evaluated in terms of the times. TR did not get to stand on FDRs shoulders.

                TR's support for conservation is probably comparable to Obama's support for addressing global warming, but let's see what actually gets done.

                Non-Lincoln, non-FDR Candidates for the better than Obama list -- now, at least, maybe not at the end of his second term:

                Eisenhower, TR, Woodrow Wilson, Washington, Jefferson, Andrew Jackson, Reagan, LBJ -- even with Vietnam, maybe even Harry Truman.

                It is, admittedly, difficult to rank Presidents because each faces a different set of challenges, and you can only rise to the occasions you face.

                LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

                by dinotrac on Sun Jan 27, 2013 at 08:31:36 PM PST

                [ Parent ]

        •  Something tells me that Obama will have a bigger (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          seat  in the history books than FDR, Lincoln or Eisenhower. I'm confident of that.

        •  4 years w/ 2 of his own party vs. 13 yrs (1+ / 0-)
          Recommended by:

          Jeez.  FDR had 13 years w/ Dems in charge.  BHO had 2.  I actually am damned impressed at what he pulled off.  Willinois' list is accurate and I for one am impressed seeing BHO in that light.  BHO is the first excellent Dem president in my lifetime (1968- ).  He is the first transformative Dem.  I LOVED WHC.  But he was an incrementalist and bought us some time til GWB killed off Goldwater's movement.  We are finally ascendant.  I love BHO and history will reflect on him well.  And he is only 1/2 done his presidency and never wants to run for public office again.  All good stuff.

          Mmmmm. Sprinkles. - H.J. Simpson.

          by ten canvassers on Mon Jan 28, 2013 at 09:26:28 AM PST

          [ Parent ]

          •  Compare like with like, and what you'll see (0+ / 0-)

            makes the current President look pretty lame by comparison.

            First --

            From 1932 to 1934, FDR had sizable majorities in Congress, but not enough for cloture, and Senate Republicans routinely filibustered the New Deal.

            So - point of comparison 1:

            1934 mid-term elections vs 2010:

            FDR occupied his first two terms with trying to do things to help a lot of people. He was actively engaged in the 1934 midterms on a theme of "Get these people out of my way so they'll stop blocking all the good things we're trying to do for you."

            He got his filibuster-proof majority.

            Democrats took a shellacking of historical proportions.

            And, of course, the New Deal with everything from Social Security, to Federal Deposit Insurance, to Steagall-Glass, to the TVA to the Works Progress Administration -- all in FDR's first term.

            Obama's got a mighty high leap to make before he can claim to be in FDR's league.

            No shame in that, by the way. That is mighty rarified air.

            LG: You know what? You got spunk. MR: Well, Yes... LG: I hate spunk!

            by dinotrac on Mon Jan 28, 2013 at 11:24:04 AM PST

            [ Parent ]

    •  Read the Frederick Douglass quote at the end... (4+ / 0-)

      ...of the diary.

      "This is NOT what I thought I'd be when I grew up."

      by itzik shpitzik on Sun Jan 27, 2013 at 07:14:55 PM PST

      [ Parent ]

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